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Old 08-04-2011, 02:54 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Ideal amount of weight to lose?

last month at Gargamel's checkup the vet told me Gargamel should lose some of the weight he has gained since he was neutered. I increased his workout (although in this heat he has not felt like walking, I can't say I blame him). I was reading other posts where it was mentioned that losing weight too fast just results in muscle loss so I am trying to see what people think too much is.

So ON July 1st he was 68.1lbs. Today, August 3rd he is 63.4 (down 4.7lbs for those, like me, who can't calculate fast)

Is 4.7lbs too much in a month? I was feeding 1.5 cups of kibble at morning and night, doggie ice cream once a night (Nature's Variety Frozen Treats for Dogs: SweetSpots Ice Cream Treats with Live Active Yogurt Cultures | Nature's Variety) and biscuits whenever he wanted them.

He now gets 1 cup of kibble in the morning and night, doggie ice cream cup at night (I could not take that away, lol) and only 6 biscuits a day.

Was taking away a third of his kibbles too much? Is 4.7lbs in a month good or too much? The vet said to come back next month and have someone look at him to see if he is ideal yet, but she thinks he will be ideal around 60lbs.

thanks in advance for your thoughts and opinions

he really loves his ice cream... And I wish I could have someone cut my kibbles in third for me lol

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Old 08-04-2011, 03:17 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Him getting fixed shouldn't have anything to do with him gaining weight. It's actually over feeding and lack of excercise that contributes to it just like it does to us. Didn't he hurt his foot or something after he was fixed and was put off from excercise even further? Bella is 47 lbs and I was giving her 2 cups a day of BB. One in morning and one at night. Now that I have her on Acana she is getting 3/4 of a cup morning and night. Plus a few cookies throughout the day. I like to keep my animals on the trim side so I would adjust his food accordingly. Obviously when the winter hits we won't be working out as much as we have been so I may have to adjust then as well. If the vet thinks 60 lbs would be a good weight for him then I would keep that as my goal. He only has 3.4 more to go Good job Ames! Posting some body shots of him before and after would give us a better idea of his progress and if the weight he has lost in the past month is to much
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Old 08-04-2011, 03:42 AM   #3 (permalink)
 
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IMO that is really too slow. Cut out all the biscuits and keep just the kibble and ice cream if you don't have the heart to take it away.

I just took 25lbs off one dog in 2 months and yeah he lost muscle but he was so obese it is deadly. He still had about 15lbs to go by the time he went back home. 4.7lbs in a month is nothing, reduce the treats and take him to a healthy weight. Do you have pictures?
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Old 08-04-2011, 03:47 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Do you have more pictures that would show side views as well? IMO adding the ice cream and biscuits isn't helping anything. Generally even if the brand is a good brand they don't digest it as well as kibble.. (or raw) IMO your giving him way too many treats, if your going to continue to do so i would cut it back to maybe 1 or 2 "ice creams" a week and no more than 2 biscuits a day.. which even then, imo is a good bit of treats.

As for the heat you'll need to work your schedule around it, have the exercising and work outs in the early AM and later PM while keeping the mid day for only as needed, short routine stuff.
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Old 08-04-2011, 03:35 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I would feed him the amount needed for the desired weight. You dont want to feed to little since he can get weak but you don't want him obese now. I'd take him for long walks or its too hot and you have ac- a treadmill will do.
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Old 08-04-2011, 05:10 PM   #6 (permalink)
 
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You can also get a food that is lower in energy content that should help too. Like Freddie said you do not want to take away too much food away. When I have a dog who is not losing weight and I already have cut back as much as I can on the daily feeding then it is time to get a food that will help them lose weight but be able to eat the same amount so they feel full. You can try a good diet food or in extreme cases where they are just not losing then you can use science diet W/D or R/D they both are made for over weight dogs and while I do not like SD that much these food are great at taking weight off. They have the least kilo calorie per cup you can get.

I provide kind of a fat camp for clients dogs when they are having a hard time losing weight. Exercise is important but usually a diet change is all that is needed to get them back to a good weight. If you really wanted to get him at a good weight you would cut out everything but kibble and put him on a diet food. You would see the weight just melt off. I do fat camp for dogs because owners do not have the heart to put their dogs on a diet, I on the other hand do not give in to those puppy eyes .
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Old 08-04-2011, 05:41 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Lol ok thanks everyone. I was worried it was too much so thanks for saying it ok and I need to do more. I will shoot for more then, less biscuits and ice cream.

The biscuits he gets are ones I make from him and contain bone meal chicken, broth, wheat flour, corn meal and cheese. I will cut those back and the ice creams as well. I work 4-12am so I walk him around 1am totally should be cool enough, we get back to the house and he is crazy crazy pup, but just doesn;t care about walking anymore.

Shanon I guess the vet was meaning after you s/n the dogs lose could become lazier. Like instead of following me from the front room to the back room pre neuter, he just walks to the middle room where he can see me, but not moving as much as he used to. His exercise has increased and yeah, he was on no fun for 3 months with his paw right after, that totally got him on a downward spin. and the biscuits and what not. I hear you on exercise but what the vet meant was the neuter caused him to lose the built in drive/desire to exercise, before he would love too do whatever when ever, now he is like eh, not into it right now, maybe later... Which is exactly what Lisa told me might happen, lol. I am so glad I did it though, all the toher crazy puppy things he still does, just not up my rump as much as he used to which is fine with me, but not fine on his belly, lol.

this was 1 week before we started, he was 68.1, dont have a better standing angle right now, sorry.


Here are some pics I just took






Oh lisa I will post more pics when we hit his goal but he was 60lb when we joined and you had mentioned back then he could lose some weight maybe their ideal is more than what he should be too. We will see next month and fingers crossed

And Freddie totally need to buy an ac myself so he can get treadmill back on, you are so right. But I trained him with treats so now he wants biscuits all the time hen he is on it if he doesn't get them he tries to stop walking. Now I need to retrain him but the weather has been hard, today went well though. Only on the 70's he lasted for 10 minutes b4 trying to stop after he realized he gets no biscuits.
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Old 08-04-2011, 05:55 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Ames....he could use a little more tuck around the waste give him to me for a few weeks and I'll have him in shape for ya Bella and I go 3 miles at 5:30 every morning. I would think under 60 lbs would be more ideal for him. Maybe 58 to 55 lbs.......maybe I'm wrong. Lisa will correct me if I am lol!! I love your boy Amy, he is so cute. No wonder why you spoil him with treats! How can you resist that face
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Old 08-04-2011, 06:16 PM   #9 (permalink)
 
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There is no right number for a dog so you just take weight off till he looks good. He is a cute little snasage! lol

Ok so if he stops walking you keep going! If you need to put him on a correction collar and do no jerk forward but keep walking and drag him. After a few feet he will walk on his own, it is much more comfortable for him to walk than just get dragged. I have had dogs even throw a fit and roll around on the ground and get dragged a few feet. They can throw a fit but if you keep walking and ignore it they will soon start to walk. Don't let him dictate how long you walk him with in reason. don't take him on a 5 mile walk or anything but if he stops you just keep walking, he will soon start walking with you.

Funny you are mentioning this problem I had two dogs I saw this week with the same problem! lol
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Old 08-04-2011, 08:09 PM   #10 (permalink)
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lol I remember how long it took me to get the weight off Penny, of course with her meds and seizures I had to go slower than you do Amy, but in 8 mo time she went from 97lbs to 59 was what she weighed when she passed. a total of 37lbs and she looked darn good I might add. Let me see if I can find pics or the thread and show ya, I cut out all treats except one in the morning and one at night, and her kibble was cut in half and I made up for what I cut with green beans Good luck, Love me some Mel

Edit - here is the thread on Pooh Bear
Penny's Weight Loss......
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Old 08-04-2011, 08:42 PM   #11 (permalink)
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As PK said theres really no magic number for ideal weight though based on the pictures losing another 3 - 4lbs probably isn't going to be a drastic change. If i had to guess i would say low 50's would probably be a goal but as you keep going the goal could change multiple times.

Hes cute but boy is he a porker! haha
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Old 08-04-2011, 08:54 PM   #12 (permalink)
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I would agree with KM. I think 50 is good. When Blue was a porker, he was in the 70 lb range...Now I have him at 50.8 lbs. I did this over a 4 month period of time. Does he like fetch? Play fetch and handwalk after. I think that will start you in the right direction.
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Old 08-04-2011, 09:56 PM   #13 (permalink)
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awwww a little porker damn and I been trying hard! Thanks for all the advice and comments, I will keep up our walks and start making him actually TAKE the walk, no matter what.

usually we go for 3-5 milers mid day since I work at 4pm, so its been super hot. I don't get home til 1am so 5:30 is NOT Happening, lol. I will not let him NOT walk anymore, figured the heat and he didn't feel like walking and why should I force him, but I will go ahead and force him, I am not letting him dig his paws in anymore. He is gonna walk if it kills me I also used to let him stop and sniff the roses as many times as he wants. I will try to concentrate on walking and no sightseeing for the most part.

On days we don't go for 3-5 miles, I always take him 3 times a day about a half mile each around our house. We fetch for about a half hour and flirt pole for 15 minutes, maybe I will start increasing that? He then plays with his unbreakoball for about an hour or 2, depending how much time I have. He pants and herds it all over my tiny yard non stop, just loves that thing, but not sure if he gets a work out or just fun out of it? (it also causes him rawness on his toes from clamping it steady with his toe and his face. I hate cause it looks like it hurts so I try not to let him play all day everyday, but he would if he could).

Tye! WOW Penny looked like a whole other dog to me. I hope Mel stays the same to me, sniff sniff, lol. But want him to live long and healthy so no more ice creams after this last pack and I will not make another batch of biscuits for a while. I told Mel this morning. He didn't seem to care.

and is Blue the pup you took a picture of last week or so? On the side of the road? sorry I forget the name but WOW he looked all muscle and no fat! Hard to picture him with weight, lol.
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Old 08-04-2011, 10:04 PM   #14 (permalink)
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awwww a little porker damn and I been trying hard! Thanks for all the advice and comments, I will keep up our walks and start making him actually TAKE the walk, no matter what.

usually we go for 3-5 milers mid day since I work at 4pm, so its been super hot. I don't get home til 1am so 5:30 is NOT Happening, lol. I will not let him NOT walk anymore, figured the heat and he didn't feel like walking and why should I force him, but I will go ahead and force him, I am not letting him dig his paws in anymore. He is gonna walk if it kills me

On days we don't go for 3-5 miles, I always take him 3 times a day about a half mile each around our house. We fetch for about a half hour and flirt pole for 15 minutes, maybe I will start increasing that? He then plays with his unbreakoball for about an hour or 2, depending how much time I have. He pants and herds it all over my tiny yard non stop, just loves that thing, but not sure if he gets a work out or just fun out of it? (it also causes him rawness on his toes from clamping it steady with his toe and his face. I hate cause it looks like it hurts so I try not to let him play all day everyday, but he would if he could).

Tye! WOW Penny looked like a whole other dog to me. I hope Mel stays the same to me, sniff sniff, lol. But want him to live long and healthy so no more ice creams after this last pack and I will not make another batch of biscuits for a while. I told Mel this morning. He didn't seem to care.

and is Blue the pup you took a picture of last week or so? On the side of the road? sorry I forget the name but WOW he looked all muscle and no fat! Hard to picture him with weight, lol.
Not trying to make you feel bad or anything but i personally wouldn't walk him quite that much during mid day if it gets as hot as it does here, especially given how much hes still overweight. An unfit dog is just like an unfit human, if a person is overweight and tries to walk say a mile in the middle of the day where it begins to be the hottest, that person is much more likely to pass out or have other health related problems vs. walking the same distance at night or at least when its cooler. It would still be difficult but less of a strain.
Of course dogs are different but i wouldn't risk it as it could cause heat exhaustion, etc. I would walk no more than a mile or mile and a half at one time during the day until at very least he starts to lose more weight and you get a sense of better health from him over all... Just to be on the safe side.

The cooler it is the longer they can go, harder they can be worked without as many breaks or risks.
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Old 08-04-2011, 10:17 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KMdogs View Post
Not trying to make you feel bad or anything but i personally wouldn't walk him quite that much during mid day if it gets as hot as it does here, especially given how much hes still overweight. An unfit dog is just like an unfit human, if a person is overweight and tries to walk say a mile in the middle of the day where it begins to be the hottest, that person is much more likely to pass out or have other health related problems vs. walking the same distance at night or at least when its cooler. It would still be difficult but less of a strain.
Of course dogs are different but i wouldn't risk it as it could cause heat exhaustion, etc. I would walk no more than a mile or mile and a half at one time during the day until at very least he starts to lose more weight and you get a sense of better health from him over all... Just to be on the safe side.

The cooler it is the longer they can go, harder they can be worked without as many breaks or risks.
oh I know its all good I SHOULD feel bad, I got him to this, I want him around and asked for help, no offence taken and thanks for your honesty! Your reasons above is why I haven't been pushing him mid day. May need to just suck it up and go at 1am when I get home and stay clear of the bars and drunk people getting out who try to run up to us and pat him, cause he sure does have a cute face lol
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