2 Pit Boys - Preventing Loss of Them

starsha · 01-19-2013, 02:44 AM

My fiance and I got two pit boys when they were 3 weeks old. I bottle fed them, took care of them when they were sick, made sure I kept them alive and babied them as if they were humans. They're getting bigger now and it's becoming apparent that they're pit bulls. My fiance is the one with all of the pit experience, but he's in jail, so I moved home with my mom who has four other dogs and we're kind of trying to work things out. I moved home when the boys were 3 to 4 months old. They integrated well with my mom's other dogs, especially the two bigger dogs. Overtime, though, that changed. My mom's biggest dog, Duggan, would threaten my littler pit, who would essentially "bow down" to him, but she feared that my bigger pit would not do the same. Then my mom's lab, Lola, would wrestle with both of my pits which never turned too violent, but she feared the bigger they got that would change. My mom has a Jack Russell Terrier and a Cocker spaniel that my pits pretty much ignored, but the Jack Russell started instigating fights with my bigger pit, which turned violent. My big pit has injured the Jack Russell twice. Not too bad, but bad enough to scare us because I accidentally strangled my baby to get him off. We decided that the best plan is to keep them separated at all times, which was hard on Lola because she really liked them.
Well, now here is my current problem, my boys fought each other. Whenever I hold one down, the other attacks, not me, but the one I'm holding down. I was trying to wash the mud off of one of their paws and a fight ensued. Nothing serious, my big one had a little cut that 10 minutes later, the littler one was licking off. I watch my boys very closely when they play and they never EVER get too violent with each other.
Since that fight, I keep muzzles on them everytime they're out of their cages. It makes me sad, but I was already told if another outbreak occurred, I would lose them.

I'm sorry this is such a long post. I guess my question is, what can I do to help my babies? They're very loving boys to not only my mom and I, but to each other. But my fiance has always warned me that the bigger they get, regardless that they're fixed, they will fight. They listen to me, yes, but he definitely had a greater authority over them that I probably will never have.

Are there any training tips or things I can do to keep them from being violent towards each other? I have lost all hope with them and the other dogs. They're been too separated from them at this point, and the Jack Russell is insistent on instigated fights, but I want them to be able to play amongst themselves without muzzles on. They're favorite was playing tug of war, which they can't do anymore ):

rabbit · 01-19-2013, 03:00 AM

Dog aggression is very common in "pit bull" type dogs. You can't erase it but you can learn to manage it. Look up crate and rotate. Dog aggression is an awesome trait in these dogs and anyone who considers owning one most respect the fact that they will at some point in time display it whether they are neutered or not. They should not be human aggressive though. So just because they'll fight each other doesn't mean they'll attack a human.

**performanceknls** · 01-19-2013, 06:10 PM

Two males or even females does not have a good chance of getting along. This is normal for the breed. They are also not "pack" dogs to be kept with other dogs. You need to keep them apart at all times and crate and rotate like we all do with multiple dogs. I just posted about this in another thread so take a look at it since your situation is similar.
Moving in together. Help!

starsha · 01-19-2013, 08:25 PM

Right now, since they're still small, I let them out together with muzzles on. If I take one out, the other cries like they're dying. I would like to think that I'd be the person that'll have two male pits that will never get too violent, but this forum has definitely gave me a reality check.
What about muzzles as adults? They have not been able to get out of them now and I keep the muzzles loose cause I'm a softy, but I don't know if the amounting aggression will make them rip through one with rage.

**American_Pit13** · 01-19-2013, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by starsha

Right now, since they're still small, I let them out together with muzzles on. If I take one out, the other cries like they're dying. I would like to think that I'd be the person that'll have two male pits that will never get too violent, but this forum has definitely gave me a reality check.
What about muzzles as adults? They have not been able to get out of them now and I keep the muzzles loose cause I'm a softy, but I don't know if the amounting aggression will make them rip through one with rage.

To keep your dogs safe you are not going to be able to be a "softy" these dogs can kill each other. It takes 1 time for a serious fight that you can stop, and you then may lose 1 or both dogs.

I have lost a dog that was placed with another person who lived with people that did not take dog aggression seriously. It is not something I would like others to go through when keeping your dogs safe is as simple as keeping them separate.

They whine when one is out and not the other, well though. They should not be let to learn that whining and throwing a fit will get them what they want.

rabbit · 01-20-2013, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by American_Pit13

They should not be let to learn that whining and throwing a fit will get them what they want.

Yes that will lead to way more problems than just dog aggression.

starsha · 01-20-2013, 02:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rabbit

Yes that will lead to way more problems than just dog aggression.

Oh I know. I'm pretty good at ignoring dog whining but my mom isn't lol

**kg420** · 01-20-2013, 03:41 AM

As stated above there's no room to be soft when it comes to this breed. They were created and bred to fight each other and dog aggression is a genetic trait many many pit bull type dogs share. It's got nothing to do with how they are raised, this is a high drive working breed and you can't change their genetics. I'm not in favor of muzzles at all I'd just crate and rotate personally. Try destracting the dog that's in the kennel when the other one comes out of his so he won't cry. Try covering his crate with a blanket so he can't see the other dog and give him something to keep him busy like a raw meat bone or a kong with frozen peanut butter. Maybe with a tasty treat and being covered up he won't mind so much. Don't give into that whining. Let them know your the boss and you won't tolerate it.

starsha · 01-20-2013, 03:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg420

As stated above there's no room to be soft when it comes to this breed. They were created and bred to fight each other and dog aggression is a genetic trait many many pit bull type dogs share. It's got nothing to do with how they are raised, this is a high drive working breed and you can't change their genetics. I'm not in favor of muzzles at all I'd just crate and rotate personally. Try destracting the dog that's in the kennel when the other one comes out of his so he won't cry. Try covering his crate with a blanket so he can't see the other dog and give him something to keep him busy like a raw meat bone or a kong with frozen peanut butter. Maybe with a tasty treat and being covered up he won't mind so much. Don't give into that whining. Let them know your the boss and you won't tolerate it.

My fiance told me I should move their cages to my room instead of in the living room since that's where they play that way the whining won't really be heard and it won't hurt their feelings that one is out and the other isn't. I never heard of a kong with frozen peanut butter though. My smaller pit has a more sensitive stomach so I get scared even giving him treats because, if given too frequent, he develops the runs.

**kg420** · 01-20-2013, 04:02 AM

That sounds perfect. It's better for them to be in a quite room when crated. The motion in the room may be getting them excited and anxious. If peanut butter is too harsh on them try a regular raw meat bone. Dogs with food and skin allergies tend to do better on a raw diet. You may want to check out the threads on switching to raw. I haven't gone full raw yet, although I'd like to, but I do give my boy raw bones. I usually get a cheap pack of beef ribs at the grocery store and slice them apart and freeze them. If I give him one every other day a pack will last almost 2 weeks

starsha · 01-20-2013, 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg420

That sounds perfect. It's better for them to be in a quite room when crated. The motion in the room may be getting them excited and anxious. If peanut butter is too harsh on them try a regular raw meat bone. Dogs with food and skin allergies tend to do better on a raw diet. You may want to check out the threads on switching to raw. I haven't gone full raw yet, although I'd like to, but I do give my boy raw bones. I usually get a cheap pack of beef ribs at the grocery store and slice them apart and freeze them. If I give him one every other day a pack will last almost 2 weeks

I will definitely look into it! Thank you (:

**kg420** · 01-20-2013, 04:12 AM

Your welcome

Skye · 01-23-2013, 05:31 PM

I've never heard that Pits are not pack animals. Arent ALL dogs pack animals?

**kg420** · 01-23-2013, 06:14 PM

No. A true APBT is not a pack dog. These dogs were bred to fight each other and leaving multiple bulldogs loose to run in a pack is just setting the dogs up for failure.

GoingPostal · 01-23-2013, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skye

I've never heard that Pits are not pack animals. Arent ALL dogs pack animals?

No, dogs display some pack behavior but even feral ones do not form stable packs. Wolves have family units for packs ie parents and their offspring, dogs are just thrown together by us and expected to get along.

OP definitely move the crates to another room, it would be easier on them to be out of sight when separated. Tire them out well before putting a dog up and give them something to chew on or eat and they will learn to settle.