Go Pitbull Forums banner

Nervous about Kane ...

Tags
kane nervous
7K views 64 replies 14 participants last post by  performanceknls 
#1 ·
So, it turns out the dog I'd thought I would be getting for my job (pest control company, using dogs to sniff out bed bugs) is not going to work out. She was a young, female golden retriever. I was happy because male/female introductions usually go easier, blahblahblah, yay a male/female household.

Well, since she won't work out, the other dog they're leaning towards is a rescue dog, mixed spitz-type breed and male. :(

Kane is generally good with other dogs. I consider him a low to medium DA dog, because his aggression tends to be situational; he has high prey drive, which I learned the hard way this summer, and he could take or leave a dog that is rude.

Earlier this week, I dog-sat a UKC APBT for a friend, a young male named Jax. Kane handled it pretty well considering this was the first time they'd met--there was some initial snark from him, setting down the rules for Jax and letting him know what Kane would and would not allow him to do during play. But once they got that figured out, with me hovering over them to make sure corrections didn't get out of hand, etc, they played like best friends. I used their crates as mini-time outs and cool down areas if they started getting too rowdy and made sure Kane's chuck-it ball was put away, as that is his crack and I wouldn't have been surprised if he got possessive of it.

But that was just for three days.

This new dog is going to be living with me and Kane for as long as I have this job (or if the company decides this dog won't work out, whatever).

So yes. Really nervous about living with two male dogs in my (small) house, and I needed to vent somewhere, lol. :hammer:
 
See less See more
#2 ·
I have 2 male dogs who DONT get along and had 2 before this set ,crate and rotate works great as you already know :) Im sure it wont be that bad , try like you did with the last male and see how it goes if it doesnt you can crate, or tellt he company a male dog isnt an option in your home. if its a company dog they should put up to house this dog properly if it doesnt work for you , really shouldnt fall on you especially if you dont have a say in what dog comes into your home. If it was my home id give them a list of breeds I will allow in here and the sex I will accept if they dont find one in those lists they canhouse the dog at the office and the dog can be picked up daily for work.
 
#3 ·
There's really no way the company can house the dog, unfortunately. The corporate office is about an hour away and I'll be working out of their office in my city. Plus, I wouldn't want the dog I use to be living and housed somewhere else, because 1) it'll be more difficult to develop a bond and working relationship (IMO) and 2) I'll lose training opportunities and company time if I have to go back and forth to get him.

They did ask what I preferred in a dog. I said nothing smaller than 40lbs (high prey drive), but I didn't care about gender as much, although I preferred a female. The problem you run into when you start limiting the dog you want to work with by breed and gender and size is that it is SO HARD to find a dog with the appropriate drive to WANT to sniff for bed bugs AND have the physical requirements you want. Plus, you have to keep the public image thing in mind, so we're already limited on the breeds we can use (no "dangerous" dogs like pit bulls, rottweilers, gsd's, etc).

I mean, this is really my dream job and EVERYTHING is paid for with this company (2012 ford escape company car with a gas/maintenance card so I don't have to pay for gas/oil change/whatever; all dog supplies like toys, crate, vet bills, etcetc). I'll make it work.

I just ... wibble about my Kanedog and his reaction. :)
 
#4 ·
Oh thats good you got to kinda pick the size of the dog and stuff I wouldnt have been happy if they placed a small dog with me LOL cant stand small dogs. And if they are paying fro everything would they go for a dog run for outside? would help if you have to seperate them ;)
 
#5 ·
Why be nervous? If they dont get alone just crate and rotate, its just that easy ;)
 
#7 ·
While I agree with you Sadie i also would say given what you feed, you have been lucky thus far to not really have any major problems with peacefulness..Unless something has changed.

My two hounds tolerate each when being worked on good days, generally they are separated at all times.. I've also never had two dogs at once that could get along peacefully, i did briefly about 6 years ago for a few months but then "IT" hit the fan needless to say... Not to say this is how your two will be Kane as like Sadie said it can happen..

Just don't leave them alone together unattended for even the most brief moment, no matter how well of an impression there is.. During play time, training or work out exercises use your best judgement.. If they seem to get along go for it but expect to eventually crate and rotate..

Expect the worst and you are prepared, expect the best and you are in a world of hurt.
 
#8 ·
I know, I know. Crate and rotate will save my butt, probably. I've just never been in a situation with a male/male household or where I've had to separate the dogs I have. I'm afraid that without that experience, it'll create problems.

Book smarts are all well and good, but experience is what you actually learn from. :)
 
#9 · (Edited)
I promise chica crate and rotate is VERY easy it really is no big deal at all! If the dogs are properly kennel trained it's even less stressful then monitoring while there together even if they do get along. No chance of an ” accident” that way you know. I personally in your situation would crate and rotate just so they would never be able to say I damaged company property!
 
#12 · (Edited)
PS If you bring any outside dog into my home my dog's will not even hesitate to take it out. I don't expect my dogs to be best friends but they better not act like crazy fools either we don't play that crap here. There is a difference in a dog who's just nuts and not manageable because it's had no home training or is fearful of other dogs and a dog who is well controlled, confident, and mentally stable but will take another dog out if the opportunity presents itself. Redog I agree with introducing them properly that is very important and may take patience and time which is another reason why you need an extra crate.
 
#13 ·
i always let them meet on nuetral ground at least twice. if that works out i put my dog in the back yard and dont let them see eachother. new dog can come in and roam the house to leave a scent. new dog goes out the front door and my dog can come in the back and sniff around but not see the new dog. if my dog seems cool then they can go face to face in the back yard. if everything stays cool they can come in the house for a bit. no toys no treats and no focusing or rough play.
 
#15 ·
i always let them meet on nuetral ground at least twice. if that works out i put my dog in the back yard and dont let them see eachother. new dog can come in and roam the house to leave a scent. new dog goes out the front door and my dog can come in the back and sniff around but not see the new dog. if my dog seems cool then they can go face to face in the back yard. if everything stays cool they can come in the house for a bit. no toys no treats and no focusing or rough play.
There you go ... :goodpost: That's the ticket boss man. A lot of dog's will fight because they are fearful or unsure of themselves or because they feel threatened by the other dog. The idea is not to allow them to interact for extended periods of time. Keep it simple toys and food will most likely always result in a fight. Like Dave said don't allow them to become too focused on each other if the dog's get too rough step in and stop it. Lola was a little brat when she came home but she has gradually found her place in the home and with the dogs who couldn't even get near her when she first interacted with them. She tried snatching up the new pup and I stopped her in the act I am going to try them again in a few days just the two of them without Bogart and Ava around and see how they do. Best of luck to you Kane let us know how it goes.
 
#14 · (Edited)
My biggest issue, is as dav said this is a working dog, keep it safe and WORK IT!!! It does not need to be treated like a pet sleeping in bed with you playing with kane ect. Not saying you can't love on it and such but maybe, just put the dog in another category labeled worker and kane pet so minimum interaction between the two is needed. Especially with Kanes history it would probably just be the safest route. Its great he is getting along with your friends dogs but truthfully if they fight your friend will most likely forgive you alot quicker them a company who valuable property would have been the one damaged.
Do you understand what I mean?
 
#17 ·
No I didn't think you were questioning me just wanted to elaborate more about what I meant by my statement. Kane has been here long enough to at least know these dogs can and will fight even if you have DA dogs in the home it can still be managed very easily I was simply saying if I have 4 game bred dogs and can manage them all it's def do able that does not mean they will get along it just means you work around it. Ariel as far as treating working dog's differently than you would your own house pet I am going to have to disagree with you there. A working dog does not need to be treated any different they just require different needs that doesn't mean they should be isolated or limited from human contact and affection or that they shouldn't be allowed to sleep in the bed .There were box dog's like Virgil who slept on the couch, with the cat, and could even play with other dog's outside of the box. Tornado was another one who was kept in doors. Working dogs often make excellent pets and can be both a worker and a pet and still be treated the same as any other dog in the home. There is nothing wrong with having a strong bond with a working dog it just depends on how you want to treat them I guess.
 
#18 ·
I actually agree with both sides of the working dog aspect.. A working dog reduced only as pet status is a waste, they should be treated as a working dog. Loving them and keeping them indoors isn't going to hurt anything however dogs kept outside that have that time apart from the handler can create a higher level of need to please...Eager to get worked..

A working dog is a working dog no matter how you cut it, bred properly, worked properly doesn't matter where they lay their head at the end of the day.
 
#19 ·
I agree with you there Km if your going to own a working dog it should be worked to it's fullest capability or it's a waste .... I just don't think it really matter's where they sleep on the floor, the bed, the couch, a chain spot a crate it really doesn't make a difference. Also working dogs should be smart enough to know when it's time to go to work it's time to work and when they are at home off the job they are just like any other dog or pet. However you want to keep them when they are in keep or preparing for a competition, hunting season ect that's a matter of preference.
 
#21 ·
The trainer I'm working with (hired by the company) has been employed by the military, FBI, and various police forces. He is very knowledgeable about training scent detection dogs and has a very honest and natural way with the dogs that's very easy to see.

He's explained to me in no uncertain terms (and this was the first day I met him, lol) that while I can treat my dog as a pet and give it all the attention and love and care that I would Kane--in the end, the dog is owned by the company and I have to keep that in mind. They could choose to give the dog to another handler in the future (as it's just me and one other handler right now) or they could decide the dog isn't going to work out and give me a new dog.

My plan is to treat the dog as I would Kane. I don't think it will be hard to keep in mind that the dog is my Work dog as I will be working and training with him every day. By the fact of the job, I'll be doing things with him that I won't be doing with Kane.

Hopefully, their introduction will go as well as Kane and Jax's ... I let them meet outside on leash first, took them on a walk together when things seemed to be going well, and then did what you mentioned Dave, letting Jax inside first to sniff around and the bringing Kane back and going from there. No toys or food or anything out, and I made sure to have their crates set up and ready to go.
 
#22 ·
After what happened you are still putting Kane lose with other dogs in the home? Did you not learn your lesson? Apparently not... what are you going to tell your job when /if Kane kills this dog? If I have a dog who has that potential they are never placed with another dog. You need to keep them separate and the only time they need to interact is if they are on leash. SMH......
 
#23 ·
:goodpost::goodpost: I had forgotten about that, the best thing to do is crate and rotate.. If your work dog gets hurt by Kane how do you think the company is going to react? Its the companies dog and if the dog gets hurt by fault of yours by trusting Kane you are costing the company money..Whether they understand the breed or not will be set aside and i can only imagine the news that could potentially stem from this scenario.
 
#24 ·
cur dog or not, get 2 crates. now keep 1 crate full at all times. the end.


km is right, working dogs work better when they arent coddled like toddlers, lisa has said the same same thing. i would keep the worker outside, hell show more willingness to please at work by doing that
 
#28 ·
cur dog or not, get 2 crates. now keep 1 crate full at all times. the end.

km is right, working dogs work better when they arent coddled like toddlers, lisa has said the same same thing. i would keep the worker outside, hell show more willingness to please at work by doing that
If you look back in your history books at some of the greatest dogs like tornado virgil centipede zebo bloero twoeyes, etc etc all were house dogs or spent the majority of time in the house a real bulldog doesn't care where he is raised as long as he is taken care of and does not live in a crate 24/7 it doesn't change his work ethic! I don't care what anyone says it's been proven that it doesn't matter.

As far as Kane goes I forgot about him and the puppy. Kane because of his history you are better off limiting contact between him and the new dog. If this dog does not belong to you than you are liable if anything happens to it there is no insurance policy that will protect you if Kane decides to take out the dog or if the dog get's hurt under your care.
 
#26 ·
In your case crating and rotating is the best choice.

I personally do not understand why some people get more than one dog purposely with the intention of having to crate and rotating. The only reason I have ever crated and rotated is if I was watching or foresting someone elses dog. I don't think it is fair to get two dogs knowing they will have to be crated. It is not the dog's fault that they are dog aggressive, it falls on the owner. If you have one APBT do not get another. This way your dog will be able to live and enjoy life outside a crate.

The only other times I support crate and rotate is for working dogs and someone who is watching a dog for someone else.

Again these are my personal opinions.
 
#30 ·
Thanks for your opinions guys.

I guess I still don't understand why I can't have Kane with other dogs (as in, my friend's dog) on a limited basis as long as I'm understanding the risks involved (ie, a fight, death, etc). This was a one-off situation and because of my previous experience with Ellie, I took several precautions I wouldn't have before.

Crate and rotate for the long-term with my work dog will be easy to put into place. My working dog will be with me all day 5 days a week, so I'll keep him in his crate at night and let Kane out. And then do weekends like you would normally, every few hours.



A few things (for both you and others to think over since you weren't the only one to say something similar about why I would get another dog):

1) I'm not getting this dog just to get a dog. I got this dog for a JOB, which will have benefits and pay at least two levels above what my previous job provided me. This new job will allow me to be more independent, taking me out of a minimum wage, paycheck-to-paycheck lifestyle. I wouldn't put Kane into this situation if there wasn't some benefit to it overall.

2) I never once said it was Kane's fault he was DA, but it's not the "owner's fault" either. It's neither the dog's fault or the owner's, but the owner can be smart and manage the situation as several people have said.

3) As you said:

I don't think it is fair to get two dogs knowing they will have to be crated. It is not the dog's fault that they are dog aggressive, it falls on the owner. If you have one APBT do not get another.

^ if that were the case, there would be several people here who wouldn't have more than one dog/APBT.
 
#29 ·
youre naming fighting dogs and that has nothing to do with working dogs.

when i say the worker can go outside im not refering to a keep, im refering to a dog that has a job and will work better for the handler.
 
#31 ·
youre naming fighting dogs and that has nothing to do with working dogs.

when i say the worker can go outside im not refering to a keep, im refering to a dog that has a job and will work better for the handler.
A pit dog is a working dog LOL dog fighting last time I checked was a sport a blood sport yes but it's still a sport ! I am not talking about a keep I am talking about any dog who is bred to perform a certain duty or task. Fighting dogs have a job they don't just dance around on their tippie toes in the box they are in the box to work. Yes it's a blood sport but it's still a sport if you consider Agility, Shutzhund ect sports than dog fighting would fall under the umbrella.
 
#33 ·
I would just worry about you leaving Kane by himself all day when you take the new dog with you everyday. Not sure but would that cause him to get pissed off more and more? or would he just ignore that you and the new dog spend all day together?

Plus I thought the puppy situation was because you left them unsupervised for a minute? Why are people acting like its the same situation with a grown dog being supervised vs. a puppy being left with an APBT unsupervised?
 
#38 ·
The sleeping outside versus inside debate isn't up for debate anyways, as the company doesn't want their dogs housed or kept outside. They want the dogs treated like our own dogs (albeit, with the knowledge that the dog could be taken away at any time and IS owned by the company and not us).

Thank you KM, I appreciate your insight.

Lauren, I guess I won't ever get what you think I'm missing. It's not like I'll ever put any of my dogs (now or in the future) into the same position, unsupervised and riled up during play. It's kind of hard to forget watching your dog die in front of you because of a mistake you made.
 
#39 ·
Oh, jealousy. It's possible, but I won't accept it. I don't care if Kane corrects the other dog or is corrected by the other dog for a valid reason. But I won't accept snark done out of jealousy or corrections that I can see are leading towards getting out of hand. A correction, bam, you're done. There's no need for anything more and I'll be right there to correct Kane (or the other dog) if it happens.
 
#40 ·
So I'm assuming you will disregard everyones advace and have the dogs together?...sigh
 
#42 · (Edited)
What is the problem, she said she is going to crate and rotate if they do not do well after being introduced. Are people thinking this is wrong because she should instantly crate and rotate and NEVER EVER introduce her dog to another dog ever because it killed a puppy when being left alone unsupervised?? I would think all unsupervised killings should be treated differently than if they killing happened right in front of the owner and they could not garner control to stop it. Or should a dog that has killed prey NEVER EVER meet another dog, EVER. period. bottom line. Is that what she (and I) are missing??

Just trying to get clarification on why people are giving her a hard time. Its one thing to not listen, but it seems like she is taking steps to ensure it never happens again, isn't that the point of learning from mistakes? I must be missing it too so don't just say she doesn't get it, please explain WHAT they are not getting instead of popping in just to shake your head, lol....
 
#45 ·
No I'm not saying never introduce him to other dogs, him and jax whatever her friend knew whats up so it was obviously worth the risk so I don't care. With this dog however there is a HUGE risk that will jeopardize you job and Kane if the company dog gets harmed. I really don't understand why you people can't understand this.

Ive said it before I'll say it again it's not now or will it ever be the fighters that get are breed banned but the " good" well meaning dog lovers that shouldn't own a pit to begin with! Now kanes mom I'm not saying you need kane takin away or whatever but think before you ever get another pit. Seriously I'm not trying to offen you just want you to think.

Like here, I have a best friend she's like a sister she thought she wanted a pit because she loved my dogs. But you know what after educating her she actually took in the information I gave her and has decided she loves pits but would not make a good pit owner. She's not offended when I tell her please never own a pit you'll endanger my breed. Instead she says I won't I'm happy lovin on your girls. And she says it with a smile!!!

Imma step off my soap box now but just saying THINK ABOUT IT!!!
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top