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Old 07-07-2012, 05:51 AM   #16 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by LovingPit View Post
Just like some mothers thinks its okay to feed their kids Fast Food every meal of the day. Guess those mothers don't care about the health and longevity of their children either.
Right on! Which is why childhood obesity is so high in this country!
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Old 07-07-2012, 03:55 PM   #17 (permalink)
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i dont really want to get into a debate here but i do want to talk to the OP.

Orca-Man! i believe u said u live in the Sacramento area, correct? which part? i live in North Highlands and there is a feed store nearby off Elk Horn in Rio Linda, River Valley Feed. That's where i buy taste of the Wild for my boy. i buy a 30lb bag for $38 and if u go to their website u can print a coupon for 15% of any toy or bedding or 10% off any feed item.im not sure what the puppy version sells for, but this feed store has a lot of good food for dogs. Blue Buffalo, Orijen, TotW, Natures Balance, Innova and more. the people there seem to know what they are talking about and are very helpful.

that being said, i also think that 3-5 cups is a bit excessive especially for a puppy. my boy is 75lbs and gets 1 cup in the morning and 1 cup at night. i think this is the real reason she is not eating, she is full. beef broth is prolly ok, although i would use a low sodium chicken broth if it were me. also, it seems to me that blue dogs tend to have more allergies than other colors, so a grain free food would be best if she is blue (i cant remember) or at the very least, a feed without corn.

all in all i wish u the best of luck and i hope that u have found some good info in this thread.
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Old 07-07-2012, 04:36 PM   #18 (permalink)
 
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Im sure you can go a bit better, $16 a month is nothing really and you get what you pay for. Even kirkland is better then that it is under $30 for a big bag of it, if you live near costco I would look into that as a better option. And 5 cups of food is alot of food per day, when we had our 90lb male he was eating about that . So when you say she isnt eating is it just possible she is full and you are expecting her to eat alot more then she physically can?
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Old 07-07-2012, 06:38 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LovingPit View Post
Just like some mothers thinks its okay to feed their kids Fast Food every meal of the day. Guess those mothers don't care about the health and longevity of their children either.
Exactly! once and a while it might not have an impact, but if you watch the documentary "super size me" it's proven. Dogs should not switch up their food all the time so that's why it can't be compared really.
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Old 07-08-2012, 06:17 AM   #20 (permalink)
 
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I understand where the OP is coming from before I educated myself and did a true test. I fed my dogs Ol'Roy it was cheap and what I thought I could afford at the time. A 50lb bag was $20. Now I feed them Blue Buffalo fish and sweet potato a 30lb bag is $57 on sale it is $50. I found that the BB lasted longer in the long run and the shine on their coats were amazing. I probably could find BB cheaper at a feed store but there are not many in my area and a distance from me. You would have time to save up for the better brand because you don't need to feed your pup as much. I have 120lb Mastiff mix and a 75lb bully mix. They get 1/2 cup in am and 1 cup at bedtime and raw veggies as treats. You may just be feeding your pup too much plus consider the weather. Heat seems to deter my dogs from eating as much when it is really hot also. In the long run you must do what is right for you and your pup. Good luck.
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Old 07-09-2012, 06:24 PM   #21 (permalink)
 

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[QUOTE=Blue_Nose_Bella;528504]As far as how much to feed....just look on the back of the bag and feed according to her weight and age. And as long as the beef broth is low sodium then it is fine to add it to her food. It will keep her nice and hydrated and also add moisture to her food. [QUOTE]

So I'm curious about the adding mositure to a dogs food?
I am a new pit owner, I have a 3 1/2 month old which i have had for about 3 weeks. I have been feeding him Taste of the Wild. I have heard about mixing wet dog food with the dry for meals, but I was never under the impression that it SHOULD be done?
Is it really that benefictical to incorporate "moisture" into a dog's meals?

If so, could i get some ideas on what others do for their puppy/dog meals?
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Old 07-09-2012, 07:01 PM   #22 (permalink)
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[quote=ktlove161125;528963][QUOTE=Blue_Nose_Bella;528504]As far as how much to feed....just look on the back of the bag and feed according to her weight and age. And as long as the beef broth is low sodium then it is fine to add it to her food. It will keep her nice and hydrated and also add moisture to her food.
Quote:

So I'm curious about the adding mositure to a dogs food?
I am a new pit owner, I have a 3 1/2 month old which i have had for about 3 weeks. I have been feeding him Taste of the Wild. I have heard about mixing wet dog food with the dry for meals, but I was never under the impression that it SHOULD be done?
Is it really that benefictical to incorporate "moisture" into a dog's meals?

If so, could i get some ideas on what others do for their puppy/dog meals?
I would start a new thread. Don't wanna thread jack this one
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Old 07-09-2012, 11:11 PM   #23 (permalink)
 

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Wow, so many mixed reviews. And i definately didnt mesn to ause a bit of a ruffle lol. Ok, so after reading all those reviews. Ill admit though. Im not "thinking about money, rather than the dog" the labelling on the package was pretty reassuring. I will admit that im a new dog owner, and im totally still learning.
My question now is. .what is "feeding raw"?
And the whole grains thing? It see,s half of you grain feed. And others dont. So what are the benefits? Draw backs of grains?
To defend my feeding amount, charlie just looks sooo scrawny. So i started putting her food and water down at all times. And giving about 4-5cups per day. But yall are definately right about not doing that anymore.
Im thinking from now on she will get 1cup in the morning. 1/2cup in the afternoon. 1cup evening. At set times. Im still torn on what to feed her. I definately want to keep her on a dry kibble type dog food, ill get something more natural, less processed for her. But what about other foods? Like rice, or pumpkin or what not. .
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Old 07-09-2012, 11:42 PM   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orca-man View Post
Wow, so many mixed reviews. And i definately didnt mesn to ause a bit of a ruffle lol. Ok, so after reading all those reviews. Ill admit though. Im not "thinking about money, rather than the dog" the labelling on the package was pretty reassuring. I will admit that im a new dog owner, and im totally still learning.
My question now is. .what is "feeding raw"?
And the whole grains thing? It see,s half of you grain feed. And others dont. So what are the benefits? Draw backs of grains?
To defend my feeding amount, charlie just looks sooo scrawny. So i started putting her food and water down at all times. And giving about 4-5cups per day. But yall are definately right about not doing that anymore.
Im thinking from now on she will get 1cup in the morning. 1/2cup in the afternoon. 1cup evening. At set times. Im still torn on what to feed her. I definately want to keep her on a dry kibble type dog food, ill get something more natural, less processed for her. But what about other foods? Like rice, or pumpkin or what not. .
Where to start.... lol. Feeding raw is exactly that, not kibble but raw chicken and beef and other raw meats including organs. If u want to stay with kibble u don't have to go grain free, but u should steer away from corn and corn meal. From my experiences these bully breed dogs tend to be allergic to corn and it is just used as a filler anyways. U can always look threw the health and nutrition section, lotsa threads like this over there.

I understand what ur saying about leaving the food out for her. That's what I did with Odin when I got him, and then he got overweight and I have been having a hard time sliming him down now, so just be watchful.

U sound like u do want what's best for Charlie, so just do ur research and read the ingrediants, not the jibberish that the brand prints out on their own bag saying how good they r. Lol. Oh and if u email TotW, they will mail u some free samples.
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Old 07-10-2012, 12:31 AM   #25 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ktlove161125 View Post
So I'm curious about the adding mositure to a dogs food?
I am a new pit owner, I have a 3 1/2 month old which i have had for about 3 weeks. I have been feeding him Taste of the Wild. I have heard about mixing wet dog food with the dry for meals, but I was never under the impression that it SHOULD be done?
Is it really that benefictical to incorporate "moisture" into a dog's meals?

If so, could i get some ideas on what others do for their puppy/dog meals?
here is the RAW subforum in case you have not found it:
https://www.gopitbull.com/raw-foods/

Here are a few threads so you can see what people feed. I am supposed to feed my boy 3-4 cups of food a day based on the package and his weight. He gets 1 and a half cups a day. Its HALF of what they recommend. LOST of factors decide in how much to give them, they are all different and digest different and you will need to figure out what works best for you. Just mean the food companies are out to have you use up your food faster so you will buy more food and spend more money for them to make a profit. Use the bag as a guideline, not a fact. I also know if we have been going all day I adjust his kibbles. I also know that if I miss training him (I try to train each day for a bit) he isn't getting his training treats and adjust for that as well.

I forget the ACTUAL percentages of water content and didn't find it in a quick search, but I know its here. Dogs typically do not get enough water, or moisture, in their day and could be come dehydrated or have it affect their bodies after a while. Even if they drink a LOT of water, their food is also a great way to get water into them. Regular kibbles have about 8%-20% water content in them. Grain free kibbles have 45%-60% water and RAW feeding is as much as 80%! fish oil is also great to add for their joints and coats. Apple Cider Vinegar (with the Mother) has TONS of advantages to adding to kibbles and so does Pumpkin or Yogurt.

https://www.gopitbull.com/health-nutr...what-feed.html
https://www.gopitbull.com/health-nutr...-you-feed.html
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Old 07-10-2012, 01:20 AM   #26 (permalink)
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[quote=ktlove161125;528963][QUOTE=Blue_Nose_Bella;528504]As far as how much to feed....just look on the back of the bag and feed according to her weight and age. And as long as the beef broth is low sodium then it is fine to add it to her food. It will keep her nice and hydrated and also add moisture to her food.
Quote:

So I'm curious about the adding mositure to a dogs food?
I am a new pit owner, I have a 3 1/2 month old which i have had for about 3 weeks. I have been feeding him Taste of the Wild. I have heard about mixing wet dog food with the dry for meals, but I was never under the impression that it SHOULD be done?
Is it really that benefictical to incorporate "moisture" into a dog's meals?

If so, could i get some ideas on what others do for their puppy/dog meals?
Here you go...this is a good read from one of the vets I find very educated on all things dog. I believe Orca-man will also find the info useful.

Here's a video if you don't feel like reading
The Best and Worst Pet Foods

Food Can Either Heal or Harm


As a proactive veterinarian interested in sustaining the natural good health of my pet patients, I always encourage pet owners to evaluate their animal's diet, because food is the foundation upon which good or ill health is built.

It's important to understand that food has the ability to heal or harm your pet, depending on the type and quality of nutrition you provide.

The first factor you should evaluate is the species-appropriateness of what your dog or cat is eating.

A species-appropriate diet contains lots of good quality protein as well as moisture. The protein is necessary because both dogs and cats are carnivores.

High moisture content is required in order to prevent organ dysfunction, including kidney failure. Dogs and cats are designed to eat food that is about 70 percent moisture, which is what a diet of mice and rabbits would provide if your pet hunted his own food.

If you feed your pet dry food only, he's getting only about 12 percent moisture instead of the 70 percent his body demands. This is especially unhealthy for cats, because they don't supplement their moisture intake by drinking large amounts of water like dogs do.

Pets on dry food diets (kibble or pelleted) live in a state of chronic, mild dehydration that over time can cause significant stress to their organs.

Species-appropriate nutrition does not contain much starch, also known as grains or carbohydrates. Corn, wheat, rice and soy are found in most commercial processed pet foods, but your dog or cat has no biological need for them.

I recommend you follow the laws of nature when it comes to your pet's diet, which is to feed everything his body needs and eliminate ingredients that provide no nourishment.

In addition to the species-appropriateness of your pet's diet, it also needs to be balanced. By balanced I mean food that contains all the vitamins, minerals and other nutrients your dog or cat needs.

This isn't something you can guess at – it should be guaranteed through testing.

Nutritional balance is vitally important because deficiencies will develop much faster in your dog or cat than they will in you. A poorly nourished puppy or kitten can end up with obvious signs of skeletal problems and organ degeneration before she's six months old.

An older animal can develop life-threatening organ degeneration, among many other not-so-obvious symptoms, over a one to three year period of eating an unbalanced, nutrient-deficient diet.

The List of Best-to-Worst Foods

1.A balanced, raw, homemade diet is the best food you can feed your dog or cat.

Raw means the food is unadulterated and still contains all the enzymes and nutrients that are typically destroyed during cooking or other types of processing.

Homemade is the best option because you are in complete control of the quality of ingredients in your pet's diet.

I recommend pets get plenty of nutritional variety, and another great thing about serving homemade is you can buy seasonal fruits and veggies on sale, as well as protein sources (meats), and use them in rotation.

2.The next best thing you can feed your pet is a commercially available raw diet. This is a raw food diet that someone else has done the heavy lifting to prepare.

It's important that the diet is balanced, and you should be aware that there are raw food pet diets entering the market that are not yet proven to be nutritionally complete. These foods often say "For supplementation or intermittent feeding" on the label.

You'll know if the raw food you've selected is balanced because it will say it right on the packaging: "This food has been proven to be nutritionally complete or adequate for all life stages."

At the present time, these diets are found only in the freezer section of small/privately owned or upscale pet boutiques – not in the big box pet stores. You can also find a selection online.

3.Cooked, balanced homemade diet. It's the same diet found in number 1, above, except that it's cooked. This means some of the nutrient composition has been diminished through processing.

4.Human-grade canned food. If the label doesn't say the ingredients are human grade, they're not. Pet food made with human-grade ingredients is also a great deal more expensive, so that's another way to tell what you're getting.

This type of diet is the most expensive you can feed your pet. What I tell my clients is, "If you have more money than time, you can purchase human-grade canned food for your dog or cat. But if you have more time than money, I recommend you make a balanced, homemade diet right in your own kitchen for a fraction of the cost."

5.Human-grade dry food. As I discussed earlier, dry food is not as species-appropriate as a moisture-dense diet. Human grade is very important because the food is approved, in theory, for human consumption, which means it doesn't contain low quality rendered by-products.

6.Super premium canned food which can be found at big box pet supply stores like Petco and PetSmart.

7.Super premium dry food.

8.Veterinary-recommended canned food. Vet recommended canned foods are purchased at your vet's office or clinic. Typical brands are Science Diet, the Purina veterinary lines, Royal Canin and Waltham.

9.Veterinary-recommended dry food.

10.Grocery store brand canned food.

11.Grocery store brand dry food.

12.Semi-most pouched food.

The reason this type of pet food is so far down the list is because in order for the food to remain "semi-moist," an ingredient called propylene glycol is added. This is a scary preservative that is a second cousin to ethylene glycol, which is antifreeze. And while propylene glycol is approved for use in pet foods, it is unhealthy for dogs and cats. I do not recommend feeding any food that contains this additive.

13.Dead last on the list and the worst thing you can feed your pet is an unbalanced, homemade diet – raw or cooked. I'm seeing an increasing number of misguided pet owners in my practice who think they're doing the right thing by serving their pet, say, a chicken breast and some veggies and calling it a day.

Yes, the food is homemade, but it's nutritionally unbalanced. Pets being fed this way are showing up at my clinic with endocrine abnormalities, skeletal issues and organ degeneration as a result of deficiencies in calcium, trace minerals and omega fatty acids.
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Old 07-10-2012, 02:22 AM   #27 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LovingPit View Post
well where you say it sounds like a nutrition issue with the dog, I honestly believe its probably because they leave the bowl down so the pup comes and goes when it wants. Also 3-4 cups a day... IS WAY too much food.

Some people just cannot afford the prices of the grain free foods. Yes I am one of them. No I do not feed purina anymore, but I am not completely grain free either. At least the food I feed now, the first two ingredients are meat... then it goes to corn meal. For someone who isn't trying to knock someone for feeding a lesser food, you sure are doing a good job of it.



The above picture is one of my Bitches that was fed Purina EVERY DAY. So where you believe it is like feeding McDonalds everyday ... Um Then why isn't my dog fat and malnutritioned? And yes, that pic is from back when I fed Purina and not after I changed foods.

Another thing, last statement. Some people cannot afford $40 for a 28LBS bag of dog food. Its better then Ol'Roy and Pedigree. Not by much, but at least its better.
Wasnt going to bother posting but.. If you don't know dog feed nutrition you shouldn't be giving advice on what is an appropriate feed and what isn't..

There is a HUGE difference between surviving and thriving, a "biologically appropriate" diet is surely not on kibble, however given it IS the simplest solution and that many feed it as the main source of nutrition it is important to understand what is and isn't good for the animal.

I feed kibble mostly however stocked up on meat, switch to raw for periods of time throughout the year. If you are feeding kibble as a main diet you need to feed what is closest to naturally appropriate as possible, corn, rice, etc is NOT.. All it is, is fillers.. Corn and rice often outsourced and VERY cheap in quality. Lower quality feeds ARE the source of skin related issues regarding feed and directly associated to other types of allergies/skin problems aside from of course, genetics.. Reason being, although an animal appears to be in good shape on the outside for "x" amount of time, the digestive system, immunity, etc takes its toll and weakens..

If your feeds two "sources" of meat are "Chicken, Chicken meal" or anything close to this, it is known as "splitting" and is common among lower end feed companies to give the appearance of two main meat sources when in reality, same amount of chicken but split into two different processes.. If your feed has corn anywhere near the top 3 of ingredients, i can bet you ANYTHING it is the REAL main ingredient in your food.. I have seen it first hand, it is the true ingredient by weight.. It is loop holes that allow your feed source to list the meat content as first. Hell, if its REALLY cheap it may just be sprayed meat flavoring listed as meat along with poor quality meat split and listed as two meats.

But hey what do i know, just from what i've learned and experienced through study, dog feed distribution, sales and visiting several feed manufacturing plants.. But don't take my word for it, do your research.

As to the "not everyone can feed grain free or good quality" argument.. theres really no excuse now in days.. If you can't afford the quality kibble needed, buying bulk raw (or knowing a hunter/being a hunter yourself) isn't all that expensive given what you get and how long it lasts.. It may be relatively expensive to start, but in a short period of time it pays off..

I've said it plenty.. Owning a dog of any sorts (or ANY animal requiring your care) is a privilege, not a right.. If you can't properly care for animal rehome and don't have one. Yeah, that upsets people because its personal don't make it less true.

Properly care meaning responsibly exercise, water, feed, use per functions, any medical attention, etc..

Maybe some of that is my OWN "opinion" however if you have no use for an animal, don't have one. The healthiest, longest living dogs and ANY animals (horses, ferrets, etc) has not only been bred true to functions but also USED per abilities instilled and not that of registry bred garbage.. Mostly pertaining to AKC/UKC show wrecks that can't do other than look pretty.

...Bit off topic..

Anyway, said my piece so take it for what its worth... I've said it all before in more details else where in this section, covering all aspects.. So OP or anyone else, feel free to search. You either will chose to listen to someone who has gained the knowledge over the course of years or choose to ignore it for what ever reason you choose.. Ain't my problem.
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Last edited by KMdogs; 07-10-2012 at 02:25 AM.
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Old 07-12-2012, 04:05 AM   #28 (permalink)
 

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I used to feed my pit Purina and Pedigree. At the time, I thought that my healthy looking puppy could tolerate anything. Well…if I could turn back the hands of time to when she was still a puppy...I would have done everything in my power to get her a better food. Under 1 year of age, she was relatively fine on the lower quality foods. But she did used to get chronic ear infections. Funny thing was…the vets never said..."Hey young lady maybe it's your dog food!" Countless vets did prescribe tons of ear meds though that never seemed to really eliminate the issue.

Between 1 and 2, she was diagnosed with Irritable Bowel Disease, food allergies and digestive issues. I spent more than I will mention on vet bills, prescription meds, etc. Several vets wanted to perform an endoscopy which I was told may (or may not) identify the specific cause of her digestive issues. Quote on that endoscopy was something like $1200-2000+ --- exact amount would have depended on what they may or may not see when they got in there. I did not want my dog put under general anesthesia when she was already in such poor health. Plus I simply could not afford it.

She was put on a Royal Canin veterinary grain-free diet. Although I realize Royal Canin is not a top quality food, it served its purpose for my dog who has IBD. It wasn't so high in protein (like the premium foods we tried over the years) that it made her IBD worse. But it (along with supplements) gave her the nutrients she needed. On RC, her immunity and overall health improved. On RC, her stool was normal, and she was not gassy or doubled up on the floor in pain from her IBD.

Luckily, at this point, her IBD is in remission and she can tolerate regular grain-free foods so we have moved forward which is a godsend. So now primarily feeding Acana which is a solid grain-free option that does not upset her tummy.
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Old 07-12-2012, 04:24 AM   #29 (permalink)
 

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I never got the endoscopy for her, because things improved. As mentioned...she has digestive issues which I now know were genetic.

Anyway my pit just turned 6 this month and she is healthy!

Her 9 brothers and sisters should have also celebrated their 6th birthday. But a while ago, I found out from a 3rd party that all of the other dogs from her litter died under the age of 3 --- which the other owners attributed to their “digestive issues.” Believe it or not --- I most definitely believe my dog's saving grace has been avoiding the grocery store dog foods like Purina and Puppy Chow. Some pits are hearty and can make it living off of anything. But many cannot. By the way, not saying anyone’s dog will have the serious issues my girl experienced.

When you read the forum comments here, it just seems like a whole lot of people's dogs experience hypersensitivity to things...and the dogs end up with other problems like chronic ear infections, skin issues, etc. Vast majority of these ear and skin issues with yeast, bacteria, etc could probably be prevented or significantly reduced by feeding a limited ingredient or grain-free diet.
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Old 07-12-2012, 10:43 AM   #30 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ladyluck145 View Post
I never got the endoscopy for her, because things improved. As mentioned...she has digestive issues which I now know were genetic.

Anyway my pit just turned 6 this month and she is healthy!

Her 9 brothers and sisters should have also celebrated their 6th birthday. But a while ago, I found out from a 3rd party that all of the other dogs from her litter died under the age of 3 --- which the other owners attributed to their “digestive issues.” Believe it or not --- I most definitely believe my dog's saving grace has been avoiding the grocery store dog foods like Purina and Puppy Chow. Some pits are hearty and can make it living off of anything. But many cannot. By the way, not saying anyone’s dog will have the serious issues my girl experienced.

When you read the forum comments here, it just seems like a whole lot of people's dogs experience hypersensitivity to things...and the dogs end up with other problems like chronic ear infections, skin issues, etc. Vast majority of these ear and skin issues with yeast, bacteria, etc could probably be prevented or significantly reduced by feeding a limited ingredient or grain-free diet.
I NEVER had my girl on any of the cheap foods...we tried Acana, wellness, taste of the wild, etc. basically all the expensive grain free kibble and nothing worked for her. She was having skin issues, losing hair, always itchy, yeast, bacteria, and breaking out in hives and welts. I put her on RAW and never looked back! She looks gorgeous and is in perfect health. I wish when more people experience skin and coat issues they would look into raw and at least try it. Amazes me how these people instead listen to their vet and pump all kinds of steroids and antibiotics in their dogs who are having allergies. Alls that does is weaken the immune system and make them more sick in the long run.
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