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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
To start this i have to go back about a year. I lived in a town where pitbull, pitbull mixes or any dog resembling a pitbull is completly banned. if you are caught with one in city limits your dog is siezed you get fined, your dog is spayed or nuetered, tattooed, and the dog has to have living arrangements in another town before you can pick them up from the shelter. if the dog is caught in town again it is put down.

I have owned this breed for my whole life. My boyfriend got me Tyson for my birthday not knowing about the breed ban. we were informed by a local vet that not only would he not have an APBT in his clinic we could not have him in the town we lived in. To my suprise there was only 1 clinic of 7 n that town that would help the breed. it disgusts me.

My boyfriend and i moved to a near by town shortly after. the town we now live in is TINY. The town which has the breed ban is where we have to buy everything for our pets. It makes me livid that i can't take Tyson, Penny, or Izzy into PetSmart for fear of someone seeing us with them in city limits. Not to mention there is no dog parks, or places to take them for socializing with new dogs. Ugh it just makes me sick. I hate the ignorance and bad rep this wonderful breed has. Tyson has changed so many minds about this breed. i wish i could just take him to meet who ever passed that stupid breed ban. But i'd have to take him into city limits for that.......:curse::curse::curse:

Sorry i just needed to rant to someone who understands.
 

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Well, I don't live in a ban area (Thank GOD!) but I do live in an area that is highly prejudiced against Pits, so I feel ya. Even when my Keira was 9 weeks old, I had mothers yanking their children away in Petsmart. :( I dress her up now, so she looks more approachable, and I use each chance as an educational moment. Because when they get around to asking what breed she is, they have already gone on about how sweet she is. I love seeing the confusion on their faces! :D

But Dog Parks are probably not a good idea with Pits. Because of dog aggression, you know? You can never trust a Pit not to fight. I don't even trust Keira not to. We have a 6 year old German Shepherd, and both dogs get crated when I am not home or I'm asleep. Keira loves to play with my neighbors little Schnauzer mix, but I keep her leashed when she does, because although she isn't DA now, she could be.

Is there another town close by that you could go to that has a Petsmart or Petco? Even if you have to go a little further, it might be worth it, if you get to take your babies.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Well, I don't live in a ban area (Thank GOD!) but I do live in an area that is highly prejudiced against Pits, so I feel ya. Even when my Keira was 9 weeks old, I had mothers yanking their children away in Petsmart. :( I dress her up now, so she looks more approachable, and I use each chance as an educational moment. Because when they get around to asking what breed she is, they have already gone on about how sweet she is. I love seeing the confusion on their faces! :D

But Dog Parks are probably not a good idea with Pits. Because of dog aggression, you know? You can never trust a Pit not to fight. I don't even trust Keira not to. We have a 6 year old German Shepherd, and both dogs get crated when I am not home or I'm asleep. Keira loves to play with my neighbors little Schnauzer mix, but I keep her leashed when she does, because although she isn't DA now, she could be.

Is there another town close by that you could go to that has a Petsmart or Petco? Even if you have to go a little further, it might be worth it, if you get to take your babies.
The closest next closest town that has a pet store is over 80 miles away. i live in the middle of arkansas. theres not a whole lot around here. And i understand what you mean about dog parks. Tyson has never had the slightest bit of DA. which may change, he's still pretty young. But i know now even at 8 weeks i'm going to have to watch one of our pups when when she gets a bit older. I'm trying to correct her while she's young but i know ill never be able to fully trust her around other dogs. We have a family owned pet store in the town with the ban. They know Ty personally and said we can bring him in. But i'm not going to risk having him any where in city limits.
 

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The closest next closest town that has a pet store is over 80 miles away. i live in the middle of arkansas. theres not a whole lot around here. And i understand what you mean about dog parks. Tyson has never had the slightest bit of DA. which may change, he's still pretty young. But i know now even at 8 weeks i'm going to have to watch one of our pups when when she gets a bit older. I'm trying to correct her while she's young but i know ill never be able to fully trust her around other dogs. We have a family owned pet store in the town with the ban. They know Ty personally and said we can bring him in. But i'm not going to risk having him any where in city limits.
Yeah, definitely don't risk it. I'm sorry there isn't one closer. :( I live about 30 minutes from Petsmart and about 45 minutes from Petco, so I know how it is to have to travel to get where you need to go. Keep trying to correct her! It may end up that you need to crate and rotate. Hopefully there will be one built closer to you soon, or that area might change their restriction, like some seem to be doing. (Changing it from BSL to dogs that have prior bites only) You never know. Until then, I would just play it safe. There are places where I have family that I can't take my dogs because of BSL, and I know how much it sucks.
 

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To start this i have to go back about a year. I lived in a town where pitbull, pitbull mixes or any dog resembling a pitbull is completly banned. if you are caught with one in city limits your dog is siezed you get fined, your dog is spayed or nuetered, tattooed, and the dog has to have living arrangements in another town before you can pick them up from the shelter. if the dog is caught in town again it is put down.

I have owned this breed for my whole life. My boyfriend got me Tyson for my birthday not knowing about the breed ban. we were informed by a local vet that not only would he not have an APBT in his clinic we could not have him in the town we lived in. To my suprise there was only 1 clinic of 7 n that town that would help the breed. it disgusts me.

My boyfriend and i moved to a near by town shortly after. the town we now live in is TINY. The town which has the breed ban is where we have to buy everything for our pets. It makes me livid that i can't take Tyson, Penny, or Izzy into PetSmart for fear of someone seeing us with them in city limits. Not to mention there is no dog parks, or places to take them for socializing with new dogs. Ugh it just makes me sick. I hate the ignorance and bad rep this wonderful breed has. Tyson has changed so many minds about this breed. i wish i could just take him to meet who ever passed that stupid breed ban. But i'd have to take him into city limits for that.......:curse::curse::curse:

Sorry i just needed to rant to someone who understands.
Stinks you had to move to keep your breed of choice and that you can't even bring them to petsmart for a treat. However, they aren't missing out on anything by going to a dog park anyways. You would just make things worse for the breed by taking them there. APBT don't need other dog friends because of there tendencies to be DA. So you are better off to stay far away from places where other dogs run free ;)
 

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I used to be cautious of phoenix because I always heard of gangs and drug activity...but I like it here. One of the reasons being that almost everyone who owns a dog has a pitbull. The negative side to that is that not all of them are the most responsible owners. I do like that the neighborhood kids get so excited to run up to my puppies and pet them and go for walks with us when they see us out because their families know the dogs are harmless when responsibly owned...
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I used to be cautious of phoenix because I always heard of gangs and drug activity...but I like it here. One of the reasons being that almost everyone who owns a dog has a pitbull. The negative side to that is that not all of them are the most responsible owners. I do like that the neighborhood kids get so excited to run up to my puppies and pet them and go for walks with us when they see us out because their families know the dogs are harmless when responsibly owned...
i wish it were that way here. unfortuantly i cant even post a pic on facebook without someone calling me a bad parent for having a pit bull and my daugther in the same house. i'm trying to organize an event to raise pitbull awareness in the town i live in now. i'm hoping to have all the details worked out and a date set for mid-october :)
 

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Its a common misconception that dogs need to play with other dogs to be socialized, in fact playing with other dogs has nothing to do with socializing. While yes especially at a young age you do need to have your pup meet and greet animals, humans and new surroundings to enforce a well adjusted, secure and confident adult dog playing is not an answer. A simple sniff, greet for a few moments and walk away gives the pup everything he or she needs to remain confident. Obed classes is another way, dogs are in the surroundings to ensure your pup can smell and see them without actually being off (or even on) lead interacting.

I have never allowed any dog past and present to play with other dogs and none of which and anxiety, broke down, insecure etc over the years. From game dogs to mixes to bandogs all have been self confident. DA? Yes however that has to do with the genetics side not the "i did not allow them to play" side.

http://www.gopitbull.com/general-discussion/38109-socializing.html that is a thread i started a while ago on socializing pups and might prove to be a good read for you on the subject.

As for the ban itself, bans we all know do not work. Its a "quick fix" that doesn't really fix anything as people will always find a way to own ____ breed thats banned as the APBT is not just the only breed affected.

In all honesty if the APBT never reached the public to the magnitude it did who knows, it may have never resulted in the problems we have today. Many people believe you can train DA out of the breed, some believe that this breed is HA and should all be exterminated, there are also myths that range from locking jaws to baby snatching midnight prowling wild animals. There wont be an end to this in the near future, education can go a long way for this breed however with the modernized mindset of our population i don't believe the general public will ever approve of a fighting breed as they once were. Times have changed, perhaps one day though i don't see it happening.

Education is great though ignoring or avoiding the real truths about their history, DA, how HA traits should be culled and not accepted in the breed, wanna be dog fighters vs dog men of the old age, etc.. This all can do much more damage than good, you praise this dog as "its all in how you raise them" more idiots go out and get this breed, theres more "pit bulls" in homes that their owners can't control and do not understand what they have at the end of the leash.

Its a vicious cycle.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Its a common misconception that dogs need to play with other dogs to be socialized, in fact playing with other dogs has nothing to do with socializing. While yes especially at a young age you do need to have your pup meet and greet animals, humans and new surroundings to enforce a well adjusted, secure and confident adult dog playing is not an answer. A simple sniff, greet for a few moments and walk away gives the pup everything he or she needs to remain confident. Obed classes is another way, dogs are in the surroundings to ensure your pup can smell and see them without actually being off (or even on) lead interacting.

I have never allowed any dog past and present to play with other dogs and none of which and anxiety, broke down, insecure etc over the years. From game dogs to mixes to bandogs all have been self confident. DA? Yes however that has to do with the genetics side not the "i did not allow them to play" side.

http://www.gopitbull.com/general-discussion/38109-socializing.html that is a thread i started a while ago on socializing pups and might prove to be a good read for you on the subject.

As for the ban itself, bans we all know do not work. Its a "quick fix" that doesn't really fix anything as people will always find a way to own ____ breed thats banned as the APBT is not just the only breed affected.

In all honesty if the APBT never reached the public to the magnitude it did who knows, it may have never resulted in the problems we have today. Many people believe you can train DA out of the breed, some believe that this breed is HA and should all be exterminated, there are also myths that range from locking jaws to baby snatching midnight prowling wild animals. There wont be an end to this in the near future, education can go a long way for this breed however with the modernized mindset of our population i don't believe the general public will ever approve of a fighting breed as they once were. Times have changed, perhaps one day though i don't see it happening.

Education is great though ignoring or avoiding the real truths about their history, DA, how HA traits should be culled and not accepted in the breed, wanna be dog fighters vs dog men of the old age, etc.. This all can do much more damage than good, you praise this dog as "its all in how you raise them" more idiots go out and get this breed, theres more "pit bulls" in homes that their owners can't control and do not understand what they have at the end of the leash.

Its a vicious cycle.
i fully understand your point, and i dont think the breed is right for everyone. that being said. i do think it's more about how you raise them than about how they are bred. You can breed a perfect dog. with no HA and show quality.... yet in the wrong hands that dog could be raised to fight, or attack, or be completly fearful of all people. that being said you can also take a dog that was from a BYB and raise him to be the most friendly, best pet out there. and i also understand that their can be gentic issues from poor breeding that can result in illy tempered dogs.

And also, my dog has no DA. he plays well with other dogs. he may be an exeption to other apbts or he may just be young at almost 2 years. i dont know. but i do know that he plays well with anything that will play with him. He plays with my cat and other dogs without the slightest sign of aggresion.
 

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English Dogge Yard
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i fully understand your point, and i dont think the breed is right for everyone. that being said. i do think it's more about how you raise them than about how they are bred. You can breed a perfect dog. with no HA and show quality.... yet in the wrong hands that dog could be raised to fight, or attack, or be completly fearful of all people. that being said you can also take a dog that was from a BYB and raise him to be the most friendly, best pet out there. and i also understand that their can be gentic issues from poor breeding that can result in illy tempered dogs.

And also, my dog has no DA. he plays well with other dogs. he may be an exeption to other apbts or he may just be young at almost 2 years. i dont know. but i do know that he plays well with anything that will play with him. He plays with my cat and other dogs without the slightest sign of aggresion.
Well the problem with "its all in how you raise them" in generally applied in DA and HA scenarios. What i mean by this is when you hear this either in passing or on the news these people will say he will never hurt a fly or he is always friendly with strangers.

Understanding the breed, what it was designed for as well as the genetics behind the APBT benefits greatly. These arguments, if you will, lack the understanding.

For the DA aspect and your dogs, there is no set time frame as to when dog aggression (DA) will "kick in" or arise. This can happen at an early age of 3 months or it can happen at the ripe age of 9. Throughout an APBT's life at any given time, any given situation DA can show itself. It isn't always so cut and dry either, it can present itself during a casual play with a "dog friend", during feeding if you have a multiple dog household and feed together, over a toy, during a walk, a pet store, etc. Sometimes theres warning, other times theres not. Another variable is the degree of which it presents, not all dogs are hot, not all are leash reactive, etc. Trusting an APBT not to fight is like trusting someone you screwed over royally (thats also mentally uneasy) with a loaded gun not to shoot you. Now am i suggesting this breed is unstable? Of course not, however the likely hood of DA is far greater than the chance of it never showing. I have been around this breed since i was a little kid, grew up around them if you will, all dogs i have owned or personally been around were DA to some degree, the degree of which has a great deal to do with the genetics of it. A bulldog game bred will more likely punch harder than one bred for as a pet (aka "pet bulls") however all of which are subject to this. Especially if you want to get into the scatter bred dogs out there as this does add less predictability and also, to some degree (small or large) unstable in understanding the outcome.. However i will keep this basic.

In well bred form DA is a fact of life, these dogs were bred around one sport. Agree or disagree with the history is purely a choice as not everyone will agree however everyone that has their hands on a bulldog needs to respect the past and fully understand what your feeding. While you may defend yourself as your experience tells you one thing (with playing) it always will prove you wrong in the end. The very people who you hear about that don't understand why their dog attacked another for no reason are those that prior to this, feel the same as you do. It wont happen to them, their dog plays nice always has, etc. I am not trying to make you feel horrible as i'm only trying to allow you to understand that owning this breed requires owners to be over prepared, ready for what can happen. Because if you are not, a full on fight (not a scruff) is something that you do not want to take on or encounter. It only takes seconds to cause major damage, if you do not have a break stick as well as trained to use one, shouting, water, pulling, etc is not going to help. The drive is immense and during this time the only thing your dog is thinking about is "i will finish this".

I do hope you stay around and encourage yourself to have an open mind and learn from those that may have greater experience than yourself. We all started some where and again i'm not trying to make you feel bad about yourself only to enlighten. Hopefully you understand, i tried to make this post to the point but easily read, without coming off as rude to you.

Mistakes will happen as we are all human, however you have an opportunity to limited these mistakes by taking in proper information, teaching yourself and allowing good information to sink in. If you wish to go against the grain, or feel your dogs are the "exception", i wish you and your dogs well.. Though i have never been proven wrong with those who believe this. Sooner or later, "it" happens.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Well the problem with "its all in how you raise them" in generally applied in DA and HA scenarios. What i mean by this is when you hear this either in passing or on the news these people will say he will never hurt a fly or he is always friendly with strangers.

Understanding the breed, what it was designed for as well as the genetics behind the APBT benefits greatly. These arguments, if you will, lack the understanding.

For the DA aspect and your dogs, there is no set time frame as to when dog aggression (DA) will "kick in" or arise. This can happen at an early age of 3 months or it can happen at the ripe age of 9. Throughout an APBT's life at any given time, any given situation DA can show itself. It isn't always so cut and dry either, it can present itself during a casual play with a "dog friend", during feeding if you have a multiple dog household and feed together, over a toy, during a walk, a pet store, etc. Sometimes theres warning, other times theres not. Another variable is the degree of which it presents, not all dogs are hot, not all are leash reactive, etc. Trusting an APBT not to fight is like trusting someone you screwed over royally (thats also mentally uneasy) with a loaded gun not to shoot you. Now am i suggesting this breed is unstable? Of course not, however the likely hood of DA is far greater than the chance of it never showing. I have been around this breed since i was a little kid, grew up around them if you will, all dogs i have owned or personally been around were DA to some degree, the degree of which has a great deal to do with the genetics of it. A bulldog game bred will more likely punch harder than one bred for as a pet (aka "pet bulls") however all of which are subject to this. Especially if you want to get into the scatter bred dogs out there as this does add less predictability and also, to some degree (small or large) unstable in understanding the outcome.. However i will keep this basic.

In well bred form DA is a fact of life, these dogs were bred around one sport. Agree or disagree with the history is purely a choice as not everyone will agree however everyone that has their hands on a bulldog needs to respect the past and fully understand what your feeding. While you may defend yourself as your experience tells you one thing (with playing) it always will prove you wrong in the end. The very people who you hear about that don't understand why their dog attacked another for no reason are those that prior to this, feel the same as you do. It wont happen to them, their dog plays nice always has, etc. I am not trying to make you feel horrible as i'm only trying to allow you to understand that owning this breed requires owners to be over prepared, ready for what can happen. Because if you are not, a full on fight (not a scruff) is something that you do not want to take on or encounter. It only takes seconds to cause major damage, if you do not have a break stick as well as trained to use one, shouting, water, pulling, etc is not going to help. The drive is immense and during this time the only thing your dog is thinking about is "i will finish this".

I do hope you stay around and encourage yourself to have an open mind and learn from those that may have greater experience than yourself. We all started some where and again i'm not trying to make you feel bad about yourself only to enlighten. Hopefully you understand, i tried to make this post to the point but easily read, without coming off as rude to you.

Mistakes will happen as we are all human, however you have an opportunity to limited these mistakes by taking in proper information, teaching yourself and allowing good information to sink in. If you wish to go against the grain, or feel your dogs are the "exception", i wish you and your dogs well.. Though i have never been proven wrong with those who believe this. Sooner or later, "it" happens.
Once again point taken. I see what your saying and do take it to heart. I don't think your being rude. And nothing you could say could make me feel like a bad dog owner. I have a regular break stick and an electric one. I know how to use both. I have never had to use either other on a pit. Have had to with 2 of my neighbours wolves getting pretty nasty a few times. But I do fully understand what could happen should things go bad a having more than 1 dog in my home.
 

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English Dogge Yard
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Once again point taken. I see what your saying and do take it to heart. I don't think your being rude. And nothing you could say could make me feel like a bad dog owner. I have a regular break stick and an electric one. I know how to use both. I have never had to use either other on a pit. Have had to with 2 of my neighbours wolves getting pretty nasty a few times. But I do fully understand what could happen should things go bad a having more than 1 dog in my home.
Just a bit of advice, Electric "break sticks" can often result in upping the situation, it can also cause a dog to redirect towards you meaning or not meaning to. These also have been proven much less effective than a standard break stick.. Not to mention can cause further injuries if not used "properly".

I will also point out that using a break stick on a non bulldog is highly risky, most breeds will constantly bite and release where as a bulldog will bite and hold. A break stick should be used only on these dogs as any other breed can not only result in hurting the dog but a greater risk of hurting yourself even with proper skills.. No other breed needs a break stick to help break up a fight.

If i were you (just a bit of advice) i would stick to the "real" break stick vs anything else on the market as a break stick has been proven for years to be the most effective. These new aged "methods" in all honesty don't work.
 

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i wish it were that way here. unfortuantly i cant even post a pic on without someone calling me a bad parent for having a pit bull and my daugther in the same house.
There are a lot of people who will say this-- especially when your daughter is young. You have to learn to ignore these kinds of negativity, and build up a thick skin to deal politely and calmly with those ignorant enough to believe the media portrayal of our breed. I got a lot of that kind of mess from friends and even family-- since even though we live in a Pit-tolerant area, the majority of people that own them have them chained and never do more with them than feed them. We're one of the few families in our area that have ours indoors. And ignore the random stuff people say online. fighting back only leads them to believe that you are crazy... believe me, I've seen it. But not all people you meet online are anti-Pit. There is a good number of people that adore them. Keira even has a fan page on FB for people... they are watching her grow up, and I get the nicest comments from people. :)
 
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