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End-F0rum-Communism
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Old school dogs rarely had cropped ears. When I thought I was gonna get into the sport 25 years ago I was told that you'd rather have the other dog just chewing on an ear as it doesn't do any damage as opposed to chewing on a nose or burying into the chest. Eventually when the ears got torn apart, they cropped some to even out the look.
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Actually they use to serve a purpose. The old game-fighting dogs had their ears cropped because it was something the other dog could have held on too if he bit the ear. Its like a girl fight, a bald one, and a the one with long hair. Guess whos going to get their hair pulled?
Incorrect. Check out this site Antohin kennels - Breeding Pit Bulls since 1992. / Welcome to Antohin kennels site and count how many cropped dogs compared to non-cropped dogs you find.

Old school dogs rarely had cropped ears. When I thought I was gonna get into the sport 25 years ago I was told that you'd rather have the other dog just chewing on an ear as it doesn't do any damage as opposed to chewing on a nose or burying into the chest. Eventually when the ears got torn apart, they cropped some to even out the look.
Correct.
 

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End-F0rum-Communism
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Incorrect. Check out this site Antohin kennels - Breeding Pit Bulls since 1992. / Welcome to Antohin kennels site and count how many cropped dogs compared to non-cropped dogs you find.

Correct.
Just because a site supplies such pics of non cropped game dogs, doesnt mean they arent out there. Here is a list.

Sorrell's CH Chopper


Sorrell's Bull ROM


Sorrell's Ch aceHurt



Sorrell's Rasin



Sorrell's RoadBlock


Sorrell's CH red lady


Sorrell's Uncle Bud



ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [21299] :: SORRELLS' BLUE MONDAY


ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [380] :: PLUMBER'S ALLIGATOR



CH CHARLIE LLOYD'S PILOT

ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [12598] :: CHARLIE LLOYD'S PILOT



CH HOOTEN'S BUTCHER BOY (4XW)

ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [239] :: HOOTEN'S BUTCHER BOY (4XW)




An tudor's Dibo 3XW



ONLINE PEDIGREES :: [9] :: TUDOR'S DIBO (3XW)
 

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I'm well aware that there were cropped game dogs. I didn't say that they weren't. The fact remains that there are far more natural eared box dogs than cropped ones. The site I linked to features hundreds of past and current dogs (from overseas obviously) and if you can be bothered to look you'd see what I'm talking about.
 
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End-F0rum-Communism
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I'm well aware that there were cropped game dogs. I didn't say that they weren't. The fact remains that there are far more natural eared box dogs than cropped ones. The site I linked to features hundreds of past and current dogs (from overseas obviously) and if you can be bothered to look you'd see what I'm talking about.
Yeah im looking through the site, and definitely most have no crop.
 

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Lots of people like crops and would never fight their dog. I don't think they I hand in hand and I have met a lot of people who just prefer the look and that's totally their choice. They are able to justify the crop to their personal preference and they feed their dog so they should be able to crop if that's what's they like. I don't like the way the head looks with a crop and others DO like the way a head looks with one. It's really to each their own but bringing fighting dogs into this kinda bothers me since I know a lot of people on here and in life who would never fight but chose to chop the ears. Doesn't make them bad people just a different approach to then end result a good looking pup. I'm not gonna lie I do wonder how they can't feel terrible about doing it lol. Even for a little while lol.
 
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Lots of people like crops and would never fight their dog. I don't think they I hand in hand and I have met a lot of people who just prefer the look and that's totally their choice. They are able to justify the crop to their personal preference and they feed their dog so thy should be able to crop I that's what's they like.
I have read every single one of those points of view, fighting, non- fighting- why they do, why they don't. At the end of the day it IS about the individual and the individual's circumstances and what they want or don't want. To lump all the reasons into one jar and say they don't because of this or they do because of that- is just senseless. Many fighting dogs didn't have a crop and some did. But that all had to do with the owner. Nowadays, we do or don't for our own reasons or purposes.

The important thing is that no dog is loved any less because of what they do or don't look like! JMO
 

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Some herding dogs have their ears cropped for hearing purposes, to better pin point sound.
Cropping ears can actually affect how well a dog pinpoints sound because an uncropped ear funnels sound down into the ear canal. As well that drop ears actually prevent debris and moisture from collecting because the drop covers the canal; if your dog's ears are dirty, it's usually because you aren't keeping an eye on it and are allowing wax to build up. Not to mention for moisture, all dogs can shake their heads to get rid of water in the ear. :)
 

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to me , i dont see a reason to crop unless they have irregular ears and you plan to show . Just seems like alot of discomfort to put on them for no other reason.
 

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If only our dogs were allowed to make us look like they want. Shave that fat ass off of her, or that big nose off of him:) I love how some of the most athletic looking dogs, who are worked out and dieted for shows are owned by the heavier people out there. Like they have will power to keep their dogs in shape so that's proving something.
 

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idk, maybe i get booed for saying this....and dont get me wrong i love the cropped look....but how does cropping the ears serve the dog?

not trying to thread jack but we cut 2 parts of their bodies off for our vanity.....the dog doesnt care about the look.

how is that not animal cruelty? because they were asleep?

sorry but ill go against the grain on this and say openly that cropping ears is a purely a selfish act and not ethical/moral thing to do. but of course this is counting that we say we LOVE our dogs.

i feel that is the direction our dogs should head in, so i had to voice this.
Well i will boo you for this comment, to say its animal cruelty is beyond reasonable. Have you ever experienced a crop or going through it with your dog ? do you see what is done? its really not that bad and has advantages. Most of my cropped dogs with the exception of 1 have NEVER had an ear infection vs my guy with natural ears that gets one about every year.
You say this is animal cruelty when its a shorer procedure and shorter healing tme then say a spay neuter where they again remove a body part, would you call someone who has there dog fixed cruel to animals? my suggestion is watch what you talk about and make sure you know your facts before you call people cruel to animals on here, that comment was very offensive to many on here who do choose to crop for reasons we shouldnt have to discuss with you.

I pretty much agree. Most people who seem to do it in the hood are trying to make the dog look tougher. Reminds me of guys who wear cut off shirts and puff their chests out. If you gotta pose to show toughness, it pretty much isn't there.
another BS remark , for someone who ows a breed who is judged in the medias eyes I would expect more from the owners. Many of us have cropped dogs yet dont live in the hood or lead a gangster lifestyle. A crop does not mean we do it to make our dogs look tougher. MOST owners are not found on google the few that are should not be looked at as the majority, you should really take a look around here at those of us with cropped dogs and see how many of us are posing with guns and cut off shirts.

I would personally only do it on even a show dog if he/she had a poor ear set and I wanted to hide it. Not worth the risk otherwise. I'm not big on putting dogs under for cosmethic reasons and crops are pretty involved/long surgeries performed on young pups, they are under a LONG time
Have you been through a crop with your dog? to comment about how long a surgery it is seems absurd to me. Its actually a very quick procedure, i usually have my dogs back after about 4 hours and that from drop off to pick up. a spay neuter surgery is usually over night and alot more invasive. the ear is only cartilage a spay neuter is alot more invsive and involves cuting into your dog. have you ever had a fixed dog?

very surprised at some of the comments in here. Its a personal prefrence on crops and I can respect someone who choses to leave natural but for those who chose to crop I dont think we should have things flung at us like " animal cruelty" or " un ethical" thats uncalled for, especially from people who obviously have no knowledge of crops and what is involved.
 
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in the end we can argue all we want, ..... what gives us the right to cut pieces of an animal we say we love....would we do that to our children? ....if a dogs ears are uneven then accept that as you would if he/she had a less than decent conformation....you wouldnt break her bones and extend them to make the dog taller and more square.....

i know its an exaggeration but i love my dog....and believe me i am not judging ...last week i asked a friend to photshop my dog with ears cropped because i wanted to see how he would look.

but at the end of the day those ears are full of expression and they should ban cropped ears at shows. that simple.

and i dont need to see what is done to stand firm on my belief that we do not have the right to do that to our beloved companions.

but i dont look down on cropping....i just know in my heart its wrong.



edit*****

oh and to add, yes i do think its cruel to neuter one s own dog . i have never done that to male nor females ..... is it that hard to control ones dog from getting pregnant or impregnating other dogs? im 39 and its never happened to me....and i know zilch about dogs. but to me they are like children....u gotta always watch em.

i have my own beliefs, ....i am sure most wont agree but i wanted a dog....not a hairy human with 4 legs.... so to me i try to let him be as much of a dog as he can be, if he jumps on the couch....well good for you Samson. I dont teach him to sit because he already knows how to sit...when he wants to sit he does.

i can take him without a leash and he obeys "come here" "stop" "no" "treat" (usually to persuade him when he is being extra stubborn) ......when i walk him i let him pull as hard as he wants...not sure why that is undesired ....because maybe then he thinks he s the alpha??? i have never hit my dog, i have yelled at it 2-3 times and i regret doing it because i saw fear....and i rather see obedience from me being consistent when i ask him to do something. and he obeys all of my commands that i only use for HIS safety.

i take him to work 2 days a week ....everyone is in love with him....i mean everyone that he sees he rushes and makes a friend immediately......

i think we should leave these animals be like god made them and we work extra hard instead of doing physical stuff to them because its simpler and more convenient.

i have my views...oh well
 

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I think you're dancing a fine line here with your words. Saying "what gives us the right to cut pieces of an animal we say we love"--as if those who crop their dog's ears love them any less.

And then saying you're not judging and not looking down on it, but that you know it's wrong. I would say if you know or believe it's wrong, then you would look down on it.

We understand that you dislike cropping and I think you should leave it there, simply said, before continuing this thread further.
 

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Angelbaby, This forum is a small percentage of people who own these dogs. I've seen a bunch of razor blade and crazy glue crops to know it's done to make the dog look tougher. You act as if I were refering to every crop out there. foolish. I know that to win in the ring a majority of winners seem to be cropped and that's their choice. To make it sound like a simple painless procedure is wrong. Picture your ear sliced half way off and it makes you cringe, medicated or not. In the end, it's to try to make your dog look better in your eyes, whether it be tougher, more regal or to show off that large dome:)
Don't put blinders on as if it's a toenail trim and also don't act like a good portion of it is for pure vanity.
 

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I'm pretty offended by people assuming that because I got my dog's ears cropped that I don't love my dog as much or that he has been abused. I would most definitely say that I love my dog way more than the majority of the population that owns this breed and i'm just saying, wow you guys. outta here.
 

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I think you're dancing a fine line here with your words. Saying "what gives us the right to cut pieces of an animal we say we love"--as if those who crop their dog's ears love them any less.

And then saying you're not judging and not looking down on it, but that you know it's wrong. I would say if you know or believe it's wrong, then you would look down on it.

We understand that you dislike cropping and I think you should leave it there, simply said, before continuing this thread further.
i am not dancing any lines....i am honest always, i always speak my mind.

how can i judge you guys for cropping when i tried doing that to my dog?????? i am not condemning anyone....i tried to to that myself a few months ago...thats why i say i am not judging...because i am guilty as well.

as far as owners loving any less....not at all....but i think at some point we want to really question our concept of animal rights. (for people to really understand would have to put themselves in the situation of the dog....if something greater than yourself castrated you, cut your ears etc etc.... you i am willing to bet if u had a choice would opt for no modifications right? so then the argument becomes that the dog has no choice because he cannot speak to us . but do we really have to ask them to know the answer?

and before i am so frowned upon......animal rights have always been improving and these are things we do have to question without getting offended.
 

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Animal rights or animal welfare? Those are two different things.

Animal rights basically means to give animals the same rights as humans.

Animal Rights is a philosophical view that animals have rights similar or the same as humans. True animal rights proponents believe that humans do not have the right to use animals at all. Animal rights proponents wish to ban all use of animals by humans.

Animal rights proponents support laws and regulations that would prohibit rodeos, horse racing, circuses, hunting, life-saving medical research using animals, raising of livestock for food, petting zoos, marine parks , breeding of purebred pets and any use of animals for industry, entertainment, sport or recreation.

Animal rights proponents believe that violence, misinformation and publicity stunts are valid uses of funding donated to their tax-exempt organizations for the purpose of helping animals.

Arson, vandalism and assault are common tactics used by underground animal rights groups to further the animal rights cause. Groups such as the Animal Liberation Front, which have been classified as terrorist by the FBI, routinely use criminal activities to further their cause.


Animal welfare basically means to treat animals in a humane manner.

Animal Welfare, as defined by the American Veterinary Medical Association, is a human responsibility that encompasses all aspects of animal well-being, including proper housing, management, disease prevention and treatment, responsible care, humane handling, and, when necessary, humane euthansia.

Animal welfare proponents seek to improve the treatment and well-being of animals.

Animal welfare proponents believe that humans can interact with animals in entertainment, industry, sport and recreation, and industry, but that the interaction should include provisions for the proper care and management for all animals involved.

Animal welfare proponents support self-regulation of animal sports, including rodeo, polo, three-day eventing, FFA competitions, horse racing, field trials and endurance riding.

Animal welfare groups utilize scientific evidence to base animal care and handling guidelines.


I find it hard to believe that cropping a dog's ears should be considered abuse, when it's a one-time thing that is done when the puppy is very young, under anesthesia, and after the recovery period, is typically never thought of again. Would you consider spaying/neutering animal abuse when it is also typically done under anesthesia and never thought of again -- and S/N isn't even relegated to young puppies; it can be done into adulthood.
 

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that is my point of view, and you and the rest can have theirs, .....a forum is to broaden ones horizons .... sharing ideas and viewpoints is how we grow.

for some reason this dog i bought (apbt 6 mos old now) has changed my eyes as to how i see my dog now compared to the last one i had...and its making me re think some of my beliefs

thats all. cheers to u all
 

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Spay and neutering is to control animal populations and serve that function. Ears are still vanity in my opinion. The one lady who knocked down my comment about people doing it for toughness has a photo of her dog in a spike collar. I kind of view it like that with a lot of people. I'm not a bleeding heart and just jumped in on this because of all the excuses I saw on the side that was for cropping. The health excuse rubbed me the wrong way. It might be common but it's not necessary and is not painless. Again, they have skin and cartilidge like us, so I think if I didn't like my daughters ears, had her put under and some cut off. How would she feel when she woke up? They aren't our children, or human and are just dogs, so it's a matter of choice.
 
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