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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
So my dog Leo has been a bit of a hassle from the beginning and has recently ( in the past week maybe) displayed some strange behavior that I would like some advice on correcting. He is not allowed on the couch unless we invite him on and even then he is instructed to lay down. He apparently has a problem with this because twice this week after being told "down" he has gotten down, then jumped back up to pee on the couch before getting off again. Its frustrating. It even happens after he has just been outside using the restroom. I have used so much cleaner trying to get out the urine and the smell since a new couch is expensive... I punish him afterwards but I know he's doing it because he's upset that he can't be on the couch when he pleases. What can I do to correct this? Thankfully its happened only while my husband is not home so he hasn't gotten upset about it and I hope to correct it before he finds out ( he loves lily but has developed some anger towards leo). Thank you for any help you can provide.
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
I also wonder if maybe he's upset with me because my hours at work have shifted from 20-25 hrs a week to 30-33hrs a week...
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Its a long pee. And he only does it when we tell him down. I tried not letting him on at all but hell jump up and pee before I can get him down. He waits for the perfect timing... and I also noticed today he pees in his kennel if I come home with groceries and unload the groceries before letting him out. And then hell start to drink the pee (gross I know)...
 

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Because he pees in the crate I think UTI but if it is just the crate and couch then it could be behavioral. If this was my pup this is how I would handle this.

Get a belly band and put it on your pup, put a thick feminine pad in it to catch the urine. Then get a long line line and attach it to his collar so he is always on leash in the house. You want about 15 feet or so and he may chew on it so don't get attached to it ;) also to keep him from getting stuck one the furniture you can cute the handle off the end and burn it to keep it from unraveling. If he tried to get the belly band off you can tell him no and give a pop on the leash till he leaves it alone, most males do fine with them.

Next if he tries to get on the couch tell him no and pop him off. If he pees he has the belly band on and no harm to the couch or your husband, lol. I would continue to have him on leash for a while till you can fix some of these issues. If he continues to pee in the crate it could be the start of a UTI where he cannot hold it that long but try this first. It does not Sound like a dominate behavior just and issue you need to fix. Also make sure he has his bed to lay on so he does not get on the couch.
 

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not much help here... but I put a blanket next to the couch.. dre and daisy used to be couch dogs.. but when we got diesel it had to change.. too many dogs for the couch.. now they go straight to the blanket instead of the couch
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Well... they had blankets until Lily ingested parts of them and had a blockage issue which totally freaked me out so they went into the trash. They also had beds...but he peed on those too... he has had a lot of pee pee issues. I'm wondering if I can just use like an old dish towel with a feminine pad? Because he tears up everything... I've seen him tear up a kong o___O which I thought was pretty indestructable.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
And he only pees in the crate when we don't let him out asap after we get home because he's upset we aren't giving him immediate attention. I'm surprised he still does this as he has been taking once daily anti anxiety meds for separation anxiety. At first they worked wonders but now I'm thinking not so much... my husband always asks "why don't you just get rid of him. He's too much hassle" but I refuse to get rid of him and am hoping everyones advice helps.
 

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Did you once post something about your husband punching him in the head or something for chasing chickens .. ? are you still with your husband ? working those long hours things at home could be going on that you don't know about ,, most people who would do that to a animal don't care and will continue doing it as long as they don get caught.. usually a pee issue it my experiences is a sign of extreme anxiety , marking , or being really afraid .. and since its when you yell at him for being on the couch I would guess its out of fear .. Sorry to sound so frank but I have to be honest here in telling you its probably something physiological from the treatment he has received.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
I leave at the same time as my husband in the morning and get home before him at night so he is never alone with the dogs. On rare occasions when he is alone with them, they stay in their kennel. Also he no longer shows anger towards them other than expressing frustrations about Leos behavior. Though I think he understands now that Leo is in a teenage boy stage and will grow into a great adult dog. I almost think Leo is marking territory because tonight when I came home from the gym Lily went to lay next to me on the couch and Leo jumped up on her from behind and knocked her down. Then he laid in front of the couch on the floor so she wouldn't come back.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I forgot to add that Leo is certainly not afraid of my husband as he was just hugging him and Leo was kissing his face about 20minutes ago. And my hubby told him "oh leo you'd be such a good dog if you didn't potty in your kennel"
 

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A dog that came to our training classes (Not as in mine, but the ones we used to go to) was a nervous peer, and he'd actually pee for a long time. It was odd, I was used to them just leaving small puddles.

When you tell her to down what do you notice body language? Looking away, yawning, ears back, mouth open, lip licking? Anything like that?
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Actually... I noticed his ears go back ... o.o almost so they look flat to his head... but I don't know that he's nervous...
 

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Actually... I noticed his ears go back ... o.o almost so they look flat to his head... but I don't know that he's nervous...
thats classic apbt look and its not nervous its just submition.

its funny i just heard stillwell, and ive heard milan in the past, talking about pit bulls holding their ears back
 

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A Pit Bull's Body language is just like other dogs. And Millan doesn't know much about dog body language... but that's a whole other topic.

I can't really tell you anything from just he puts his ears back, sometimes when dogs are really excited they will, partially back if anxious, fearful ears back, going into flight stage ears back, submissive = ears back. So I can't draw a conclusion from that you see? :)

It's all good though, you have some suggestions above.

I'm leaning towards submissive as you didn't see the other body language signs mentioned.
 

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That was the first thing I though of was submissive peeing but if he is doing it in other places then I thought it could be something else. How long are the pups in the crate for when you are not home?

I will say it is incredible rare for a young pup to have separation anxiety like that and treating them with medication can make things worse and the dogs not act normal. When you drug a dog they are not having normal responses to everyday situations and trying to figure out what is going on it hard because it is masked by drugs. I am not a fan of drugs like that used on dogs and I do not use them to treat dogs with anxiety. I have seen just about every type of dog you can run into and all of them have been able to do great without the use of meds. I feel meds just like with many people are offered to mask the problem instead of actually handle it.

Also brain trauma like that can lead to brain damage and dogs can get something similar to shaken baby syndrome. It can cause all kinds of problems including seizures down the road.
 

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Something else I just thought of, do you praise him when he gets down? It may not be exactly clear to him what you want also. You have to let them know when they're doing what you want. Dogs do what they find rewarding, if they get more attention (even if it is negative attention) doing something they're not suppose to, they may continue to do it. So I'd strart praising him often when he's not on the couch. So that being off the couch becomes more rewarding.
If he is partially doing it for attention, he'll start to go "Oh, I get praised when I'm not on the couch, this is more fun."
Sorry if that doesn't make sense, I'm typing this in haste.

It's not dominance though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I praise him and tell him " good down Leo" and scratch behind his ears and rub under his chin. He doesn't have head trauma that the vet could see when we took him in before after the isolated incident. How do you stop submissive peeing? The time they are in the kennel each day varies. Usually its while we are at work and asleep and I average 5 hours of work per day. And then 8 hours of sleep... and maybe an extra hour of kennel time while we go to the gym or store.
 

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I hope you don't mind all the questions I asked. It's hard to figure things out when you don't see it in person. ;)

I haven't had much experience with submissive peeing in this sense. I have helped friends with dogs who pee submissively when they get home. Which we fixed by ignoring the dog until he was calm, and treating him when he calmed down. And gave him attention only when he was calm. But this is a different situation. I'll see if I can think of something.
 

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I praise him and tell him " good down Leo" and scratch behind his ears and rub under his chin. He doesn't have head trauma that the vet could see when we took him in before after the isolated incident. How do you stop submissive peeing? The time they are in the kennel each day varies. Usually its while we are at work and asleep and I average 5 hours of work per day. And then 8 hours of sleep... and maybe an extra hour of kennel time while we go to the gym or store.
Well you cannot tell brain damage like that unless you did an MRI just looking at a dog is not good enough. If these behaviors started after that it is a good possibility. Also the fact you have his om meds really makes it hard to tell what is really going on. Submissive peeing cannot really be fixed you have to ignore it and it normally goes away. Because he is also peeing in the crate I am not thinking it is submissive peeing but again it is hard to tell. Over correction can make nervous peeing, and also just a soft dog but they normally grow out of it if you give them no reason to be worried. They are not crated too much and again without seeing them it is hard to say but guess is the meds have something to do with it or the head trauma. Head trauma would make sense ( I know you will not consider this but it fits) given the some of the pups behavior issues are above what a normal happy balanced dog would be. Some dogs are just not wired right or have had something like that happen to them and as a result you get these weird behavior issues. Like peeing in a crate when he sees you and you do not let him out, sever separation anxiety is caused by the owners or because he is just not right. IMO I think these can be managed with a little creativity on your part but definitely not typical issues you would see in dog or pup.

I have worked with many dogs that had some type of trauma and I owned one myself. Rogue was rescued from these boys that had beat her and hit her in the head. It was only one incident and the problems did not develop till way later. These she had these weird behavior issues and then the seizures hit at about 2 years old, she was put down at 2.5 years. My point it any hit to the head at a young age can cause serious health issues and you cannot rule that out.
 
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