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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
im so exhausted educating the young people that think there breeders and know everything. Im on another off topic where everyboody and there mother breed pits and under the ''for sale'' forums there were pits 4/s and people wanting to stud there dogs for $$. After harassing moderators they made it a rule ''no selling animals'' :)

Now my question is does anybody have a link or something i can copy and paste about the differances between a byb and a legit breeder and why byb is causing such a big problem........im tired of explaining. Even after infractions are givin out people still post there breedings ugghh

thanks
 

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that looks like A good reference.
and to many folks today,anyone who bred pits 20-30-50 years ago was A BYB.LOL
:rofl::clap:
I went to another site since it was a lot of "bully" and "bloodlines" that I'd be interested in and the whole site is nothing but adds for studs,bitches and puppies...I mean, it should just be a breeders site, nothing more of interest seems to be there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
im really starting to dislike all bully breeders. they have new litters every week and rarelly if none of them health test.

sure bullies look nice but i dont see me supporting there breeders habits. If i ever want a bully id just go get a thick amstaff from a reputable breeder
 

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im really starting to dislike all bully breeders. they have new litters every week and rarelly if none of them health test.

sure bullies look nice but i dont see me supporting there breeders habits. If i ever want a bully id just go get a thick amstaff from a reputable breeder
I think thats a rude remark I know of a bully breeder who does health test his dogs and he hasnt had a breeding since last year he isnt popping them off one after the other as you seem to think. if your gonna make this remark about BULLY breeders then maybe you should make those comments about alot of other breeds as well . BYB breed EVERY breed toys, game, bull everything. the ABKC is trying to educate people and get reputable bully breeders out there they arent all as you seem to think they are.
 
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I think thats a rude remark I know of a bully breeder who does health test his dogs and he hasnt had a breeding since last year he isnt popping them off one after the other as you seem to think. if your gonna make this remark about BULLY breeders then maybe you should make those comments about alot of other breeds as well . BYB breed EVERY breed toys, game, bull everything. the ABKC is trying to educate people and get reputable bully breeders out there they arent all as you seem to think they are.
didnt want to come off rude but the websites 'i see' arent the most impressive i only saw 2 that claimed they health test

pm me some sites id take a look
 

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I would have to truthfully say about 90% - 95% of breeding in New Zealand are BYB
 

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the one i know doesnt use a website he is strictly word of mouth , I was just commenting that he shouldnt say all bully breeders are BYB and dont health test i think thats a little harsh , i had no problem with what you were saying but to say he wouldnt get a bully because all the breeders are crap is wrong there are a few and I guess you have to look for them. trust me I know of bad ones as well and learning to look for the good ones they are out there.
 

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bullys are no different than A peekapoo,or A labradoodle,or pompoo.
they wreak of designer,and serve gainfully/monetarily under the moniker of the APBT.
ya'll can jump and scream all you want.
I can disprove it as A breed,let alone A quality breed long before anyone can prove different.
lets start with the inception of the registry,then the purity of the blood by DNA.
like MR. L. Colby said in an interview,this was cut and pasted from another thread.
Me: what is your input on this new breed called bullys? and how would you say your dogs stack up against them?
Mr. Colby: Bullies are ridculous. They are not a breed. Whoever started this is nor a bonefide dogman, just looking to make a fast buck from some uninformed person who is looking for the "macho" look. APBTs are supposed to be athletes. A Colby dog, pound for pound, will whip them. You choose the sport.!!!

I've always felt this way,but then,I'm old dog bound.
 

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:goodpost:

Spot on Mr Colby
 

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Not even gonna argue with idiots on here who dont like a certain breed good for you for whatever you like but to dis a breed because you dont care for it is stupid. There is a huge debate over bullys vs ABPT but seriously If you truely loved dogs you would try to unite as a force to fight all the BSL , BYB that affect both these breeds but instead you "old dog men" want to argue and put down other peoples choices there are enough BS that we all have to put up with in the world owning these dogs we really dont need the boundarys you guys create among the bully/APBT world. your choice of dog may not be my cup of tea but I would put my a$$ on the line to protect that dog because I care about the dogs. if you think the bully breeders are the only ones doing things unethical out there and BYB then you seriously need to open your eyes I see it APBT, american bulldogs, bullys, poodles , everything open up your classifieds in your paper. Dont turn this into a bully breeder hater thread a BYB is a BYB no matter the breed.
 
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Not even gonna argue with idiots on here who dont like a certain breed good for you for whatever you like but to dis a breed because you dont care for it is stupid. There is a huge debate over bullys vs ABPT but seriously If you truely loved dogs you would try to unite as a force to fight all the BSL , BYB that affect both these breeds but instead you "old dog men" want to argue and put down other peoples choices there are enough BS that we all have to put up with in the world owning these dogs we really dont need the boundarys you guys create among the bully/APBT world. your choice of dog may not be my cup of tea but I would put my a$$ on the line to protect that dog because I care about the dogs. if you think the bully breeders are the only ones doing things unethical out there and BYB then you seriously need to open your eyes I see it APBT, american bulldogs, bullys, poodles , everything open up your classifieds in your paper. Dont turn this into a bully breeder hater thread a BYB is a BYB no matter the breed.
I shot off on all designer dogs.they're all the same.
 

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Not even gonna argue with idiots on here who dont like a certain breed good for you for whatever you like but to dis a breed because you dont care for it is stupid. There is a huge debate over bullys vs ABPT but seriously If you truely loved dogs you would try to unite as a force to fight all the BSL , BYB that affect both these breeds but instead you "old dog men" want to argue and put down other peoples choices there are enough BS that we all have to put up with in the world owning these dogs we really dont need the boundarys you guys create among the bully/APBT world. your choice of dog may not be my cup of tea but I would put my a$$ on the line to protect that dog because I care about the dogs. if you think the bully breeders are the only ones doing things unethical out there and BYB then you seriously need to open your eyes I see it APBT, american bulldogs, bullys, poodles , everything open up your classifieds in your paper. Dont turn this into a bully breeder hater thread a BYB is a BYB no matter the breed.
The old dogmen aren't shooting them down and talking about them because they don't like them.They are doing it because the majority of bully breeders are calling themselves apbt breeders.
 

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Code of Ethics For Breeders of American Pit Bull Terriers/American Staffordshire Terriers

Section I: Introduction & Mission Statement

Introduction: This Code of Ethics is being presented by the Pit Bull Owners Alliance (PBOA). The material presented herein is to serve as a guide for breeders and reference tool for potential buyers seeking out breeders. The goal in presenting this Code of Ethics is not to promote Pit Bull breeding, but rather to discourage indiscriminate breeding, poor breeding practices, and support of unethical breeders. PBOA supports and encourages rescue above and beyond breeding or purchasing Pit Bulls.

Mission Statement: The ethical breeder of American Pit Bull Terriers and/or American Staffordshire Terriers ("Pit Bulls") shall always hold paramount the future of the breed. A desire for betterment and preservation of the Pit Bull breed should be the sole driving force behind a breeder's choice to produce puppies.

1) The breed's future: because of a) anti-Pit Bull legislation, b) irresponsible ownership, c) criminal animal abuse, and d) a surplus of dogs, the future of the Pit Bull is in jeopardy. Prior to planning a litter, a breeder should ask himself/herself if the litter will jeopardize the future of the breed by contributing in any way to a, b, c, and/or d above.

2) Betterment of the breed: the goal of the ethical Pit Bull breeder should always be, first and foremost, to better the breed through the production of puppies that are as good as or superior to the previous generation. Production of Pit Bulls that ideally represent the United Kennel Club (UKC), American Dog Breeders Association (ADBA), and/or American Kennel Club (AKC) Standard(s) should be considered the pinnacle of a Pit Bull breeding program.

3) Preservation of the breed: ethical breeders should work to preserve, through legal and humane means, the Pit Bull breed as it was, is and should be. Means to achieve this goal include: protecting the integrity of the breed through adherence to the Standards; careful culling (via sterilization, and/or humane euthanasia when necessary) of sub-standard stock; meticulous record-keeping, DNA profiling, microchipping, and pedigree research; studying to achieve a scholarly knowledge of breed history, temperament, health, structure, and genetics.

Section II: Actions of the Ethical Pit Bull Breeder

Note 1: For simplicity's sake, "dog" will apply to both sexes. "Breeding stock" will apply to any dog or dogs that the Ethical Pit Bull breeder will breed, allow to be bred, or pay for the breeding services of.

Note 2: The pedigrees (previous generations) of all breeding stock should be considered as important as the breeding stock itself.

Note 3: Proper care, management and training are beyond the scope of this document. However an Ethical Pit Bull Breeder keeps their dogs well trained, in good health, in clean quarters, provides daily exercise and mental stimulation, and does not keep more dogs than can adequately be provided for.

The Ethical Pit Bull Breeder chooses breeding stock based on several criteria:

a) correctness of temperament (see #2 and Item 2)
b) health and vitality of the individual dogs (see #3, Item 3, and Note 3)
c) conformity to the applicable breed standard of the recognized Pit Bull registry (see # 5)
d) qualities the individual dogs may offer to future generations
e) qualities the pedigrees of the individual dogs may offer to future generations

The Ethical Pit Bull Breeder holds "A" and "B" above paramount above all other considerations when choosing breeding stock.

The Ethical Pit Bull Breeder:

1) has an extensive knowledge of Pit Bulls (their history, genetics, the Standards, care, training), as well as a strong understanding of breeding practices, canine health, and dog behavior/training

2) chooses breeding stock that is temperamentally sound and representative of the Standards. In addition, the Ethical Pit Bull Breeder does not breed any Pit Bull that is human-aggressive, fearful, exhibits behavior typically seen in breeds of the protection/guardian group, nor any Pit Bull that is not "temperament correct" (see item 3 below).

Item 2: The temperament correct Pit Bull: seeks out human interaction; is responsive, biddable and eager to please; may be genetically predisposed to aggression towards other dogs or animals; is appropriately submissive; is well balanced and optimistic; enjoys handling; presents good eye contact; is able to be calm in the presence of other dogs on leash or - if initially leash reactive - can learn how to tolerate their presence; is willing to connect with handler during high arousal; can be handled safely even in times of high arousal; accepts a reasonable amount of confinement; drops arousal levels quickly when removed from a stressful situation; is social with people of all types; is responsive and good natured; is never aggressive towards humans.

3) health tests all breeding stock prior to breeding, and certifies health of breeding stock prior to breeding where such certifications are available. Tests and certifications shall be conducted and processed prior to any dog being bred. Required health tests and certifications include: hips, elbows, thyroid, and heart (evaluated and certified by organizations such as Orthopedic Foundation for Animals [OFA] for hips, elbows, thyroid, and heart, or PennHip for hips). Dogs should test negative for Brucellosis and von Willebrand's Disease. Additional testing may be conducted for the following health abnormalties: Spinocerebellar/Hereditary Ataxia (specifically on American Staffordshire Terriers), and Progressive Retinal Atrophy (PRA) with subsequent registration with Canine Eye Registry Foundation (CERF) encouraged for dogs free of PRA. Results and certifications of any and all tests will be made readily available to potential buyers if tested and certified dogs will be bred. In addition, immediately prior to each breeding, all breeding stock should pass a basic veterinary health examination and be determined to be in good health.

Item 3: No dog with unsatisfactory health tests and/or certification results shall ever be bred. Unsatisfactory results would be (among others):

a) OFA hip ratings below fair
b) OFA elbow ratings that indicated elbow dysplasia
c) PennHip ratings that show abnormal joint laxity
d) thyroids that do not test normal; thyroids that test TgAA positive
e) hearts that are not found to be clear of murmurs or other abnormalities upon examination with a Doppler (ultrasound) exam by a Board Certified Cardiologist
f) positive tests for Spincerebellar/Hereditary Ataxia
g) positive tests for PRA
h) positive tests for any other hereditary/congenital/genetic disease

Note 3) No dog that has ever been diagnosed with a hereditary/congenital skin disease (including demodectic mange) shall ever be bred. A dog with chronic health problems (such as skin allergies) and/or weaknesses, and/or immune weakness shall never be bred. A dog that has torn anterior cruxiate cigaments (ACL) shall never be bred unless the torn ligaments were damaged because of conceivable stress and/or injury which indicate normal environmental causes and not hereditary/congenital/genetic weakness.

5) chooses breeding stock that conforms to the Standard(s) of the applicable recognized Pit Bull registry.

6) registers breeding stock and produced litters with a recognized Pit Bull registry.
Item 1: For the sake of this Code of Ethics, recognized Pit Bull registries will be considered the United Kennel Club and the American Dog Breeders Association (for American Pit Bull Terriers and American Staffordshire Terriers being registered as American Pit Bull Terriers), and the American Kennel Club (for American Staffordshire Terriers). These organizations are the oldest and hold breed standards that are most sought after and followed.

7) only breeds mature (over 2 years of age) dogs. Does not breed elderly bitches, nor does the Ethical Pit Bull breeder breed any one bitch more than once every 24 months.

seeks validation of quality of breeding stock through competition in organized dog sports and subsequent achievement of titles and certifications such as:

a) UKC, ADBA, and AKC conformation, obedience, agility, and performance titles
b) certifications such as the AKC's Canine Good Citizen (CGC), American Temperament
Test Society's Temperament Tested (TT), Therapy Dogs International's Therapy Dog International (TDI), and other similar, valid certifications.
c) events, titles, and certifications offered by other valid organizations.

9) breeds less than 3 litters every year. Should ideally breed no more than 1 litter a year.

10) breeds when there is a specific demand for the puppies, and owners for puppies have been predetermined before birth.

Section III: Puppies, Placement, and Care

Note 5: Section III also applies to adolescent dogs and/or adult dogs any breeder may have in their care and potentially place.

1) chooses homes based on ability to properly care for and handle a Pit Bull, and acts as match maker between puppy/dog and potential owner to ensure compatibility.

Item 4: The quality of the home any puppy or dog is placed into should be of great importance. The Ethical Pit Bull Breeder only considers a potential owner that:

a) has already done good breed research. Asks good questions. Shows willingness to learn more
b) is realistic about breed challenges (dog-aggression, high energy levels, strong and pushy, breed specific legislation, rental and home owners insurance issues, bad reputation of breed, etc.)
c) shows a stable, mature, open-minded personality
d) is happy to be interviewed and receive a home inspection
e) is physically capable of handling a strong dog
f) wants an indoor pet as a companion animal/family member
g) has had some dog experience and knowledge of basic training.
h) has a reasonably active lifestyle and is prepared to satisfy dog's daily exercise needs
i) owns a home or has a secure rental that will allow a Pit Bull (should provide proof in lease)
j) can provide safe containment: tall, secure fences if yard is present and working latches on gates.
k) lives in a household (includes roommates, children, seniors) that is involved in the decision to bring a Pit Bull into the family and is able to help manage a dog
l) has other pets in the home that are a good match and understands that Pit Bull must be separated from other pets when not supervised

12) socializes and conducts basic training with all puppies before sending them to their new homes.

13) microchips all puppies prior to sending them to their new homes.

14) does not place puppies under 8 weeks of age.

15) does not place puppies in areas where breed specific legislation that would endanger the puppy's life or quality of life exists.

16) provides legally-binding, non-expiring contracts upon purchase that protect buyer as well as puppy. Contract certifies health (congenital, genetic, hereditary) and temperamental soundness of puppy. Assures puppy is disease-free prior to placement through records detailing proper veterinary and health care. Contract includes clause that requires new owner to relocate with the dog, or return the dog to the Ethical Pit Bull Breeder in the event that breed specific legislation that would endanger the puppy's life or quality of life is enacted in the new owner's city/state.

17) takes responsibility for any puppy produced, during any point in the lifetime of that puppy, should the original home become unable to care for the puppy or grown adult dog.

18) sends puppies home with papers from the recognized Pit Bull registry to allow the new owner to register the puppy in his/her name; unless the puppy is pet stock and is not spayed or neutered prior to going to new home, in which case, the Ethical Pit Bull Breeder will withhold papers until the new owner can provide proof of spay/neuter. It is strongly advised, however, that the Ethical Pit Bull Breeder spays/neuters all pet stock prior to placement in new homes.

Item 5: "Pet stock" is any puppy that is not or would not potentially be bred by an Ethical Pit Bull Breeder, and/or any puppy that will not potentially be shown in conformation events.

19) after sending puppy home, offers support indefinitely to new owner by way of breed counseling, training/behavior advice, health care information, referrals, etc.

20) recognizes that breeding is not a money making venture, a business, nor a means to bring in extra money. Stud fees and sale prices of puppies should reflect the costs of ethical breeding. The ethical breeder does not see a profit at the end of the year, but may actually see a loss.

(C) 2005 Mary Harwelik & Pit Bull Owners Alliance
 

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Not even gonna argue with idiots on here who dont like a certain breed good for you for whatever you like but to dis a breed because you dont care for it is stupid. There is a huge debate over bullys vs ABPT but seriously If you truely loved dogs you would try to unite as a force to fight all the BSL , BYB that affect both these breeds but instead you "old dog men" want to argue and put down other peoples choices there are enough BS that we all have to put up with in the world owning these dogs we really dont need the boundarys you guys create among the bully/APBT world. your choice of dog may not be my cup of tea but I would put my ass on the line to protect that dog because I care about the dogs. if you think the bully breeders are the only ones doing things unethical out there and BYB then you seriously need to open your eyes I see it APBT, american bulldogs, bullys, poodles , everything open up your classifieds in your paper. Dont turn this into a bully breeder hater thread a BYB is a BYB no matter the breed.
I ain't buying into the "we are the world" BS. When the "old dogmen" spend 30 years destroying the reputation of another breed, then I'll agree you have something to bitch about.
 
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Wasn't Pit Bull also mix/cross breed of different dogs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pit_bull)? Why hate bully dog? That's just pure discrimination. If we discriminate one breed (yes, I called it breed because it's alive), then we are no different from all those who are against pit bulls.
it's the foundation,the lying,the unscrupulous methods with which the breed was propogated.it is for nothing more than to line pockets.
their was never A pit bull sold 20 years ago for 5 grand unless it was A proven dog and then used for the propogation of more dogs that would be proven or culled.
theirs not A single bully worth the asking price,based on the purpose of what pits were bred for.
you can't compare A designer dog,bred for no other reason than to make money and fullfill the machismo or machisma with which they are held in.
I'm not against the dog,I dislike the way they bred under,over and all around the pit bull.they advertise them as pits,they ride the pit bull coattail,and then one day they start A breed like they've done something spectacular.
theirs some of us that are way all to familiar with all the tactics and scandalous behavior of the scumbags who bred them gotti and RE pigs.
don't hate on me for my fact based dillusion of what some posers did.
they're just A bunch of money grubbin worms that exploited A perfect dog,and now folks want to assimilate them oinkers to my pit.
when folks ask me if my dog is A bully I say no,she doen't puke on herself during sex,in the box she would whale on any bully,she'll outswim,jump pull,hunt,fight,or love them.
and she doesn't have to have beauty sleep or ego strokes from me or anyone else.
 

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I definitely disagree about the 5g dogs, that is just plain ridiculous, especially with no active competition history. I'm guessing there were people who also hated the idea of crossbreeding bulldogs and terriers back in the 1800's. Are the APBT, AST, SBT accepted as A quality breed now? I think bullys look just as awesome as APBT.
 
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