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Got Simba in the cage, put his bed in there and a few chew toys and went to the lake. I was gonna take him to the doggy park but came across pit bull brick wall. Im not sure if it's all of Broward but Sunrise has an ordinance for pit bulls and they cant be in the dog park without a muzzle or leash. This law was signed in 1989 and I think it's discrimination. These dogs were once called nanny dogs for their gentleness with kids. The media and bad irresponsible owners has really gave pits a bad rep.Even though he's just a puppy I was so upset that I decided to not go there. We decided to park the Ex by the lake and have some play time. Had to watch out for alligators but only saw a large wild iguana.





















 

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Welcome to the unfair world of owning a "pitbull"! There will be harsh signs, bsl bs, rude comments ect. being thrown at you because you own a aggressive breed so to say. Its tough to bite your tongue and keep your head up but all of us have had to do it at some point. All the advice I can give for now is; stay far far away from dog parks! Their is ignorant owners & dogs with no manners! You owe it to your new pup to not put him in that out of control enviorment. Think of it in the positive light... You and your pup are too good to go there. There is plently of safe places to take him that you both can have a great time. Other than that, get him enrolled in puppy classes to socialize, start obidience training and always create a positive enviorment for him.
In my town, law is not quite BSL YET, but pitbulls must be on a 6" leash (ya, where do you buy one of thos? Haha), have a muzzle and if not in the house, must be inside a kennel inside a privacy fence, be microchipped, and spayed or neutered ect. So your not alone on the discrimination part; might as well be jail! But I do what I gotta do to keep my family together; along with making sure my babies are the most well behaved dogs in my whole town and constently rubbing it in to the haters every darn chance I get! Ha!
All in all, its a tough road but the kisses and lovins are the highlight of my life!
 

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I think its a great rule. Type in dog park in the search bar at the top , tons to read on here about it. fact is this breed is known to be DA at some time in there life its in there genes and should be expected. Its when people who think they can "train this out of them" or "cure " them of this characturistic known to this breed where we run into problems. Those people thinking there dog would never start anything { they dont always have to be the dog who starts it but if they end it who do you think will be blamed?, and all our dogs have the capability to end things quick}. Then our breed looks bad yet again , because that owner chose to ignore a key part of this breed and put there dog in a situation to fail. I always say dont set your dog up to fail and they wont. Im against dog parks all together , health issues, fight issues, other stupid owner issues its not good all around. Socializing your dog has nothing to do with other dogs, its new places, new surroundings, new people thats what you should focus socializing around. If you have a friend with a suitable dog to play with do private play dates where its alot more controlled and you know the other owners . Alot of dog park people go and then start yapping away and dont even pay attention to what there dog is doing and miss warning signs that ar ehappening right infront of them. Wish every dog park had that rule,would help us as a community against the irresponsible owners who think there "pit bull" is so much different then the rest of them.
 

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In my town, law is not quite BSL YET, but pitbulls must be on a 6" leash (ya, where do you buy one of thos? Haha), have a muzzle and if not in the house, must be inside a kennel inside a privacy fence, be microchipped, and spayed or neutered ect.
How is that not BSL?? If you HAVE to do those things in order to have a pit bull type dog, that's BSL. I don't have to do any of that with Kane for the area I live in.

Good tips on socialization, though.
 

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Socializing your dog has nothing to do with other dogs, its new places, new surroundings, new people thats what you should focus socializing around. If you have a friend with a suitable dog to play with do private play dates where its alot more controlled and you know the other owners .
This is where I'm going to disagree. I think it's important to socialize your dog to other dogs as it builds valuable communication skills and manners, that way you can walk your dog on the street or go into Petsmart and not have them go ballistic at the sight of another dog because they've never met a dog that looks like that. Unlike what I did though, thinking I could keep socializing Kane to strange dogs throughout his life, I think it's best to keep the strange dog socializing to a minimum once your dog is older than 8-9 months. During that time, they've already built the communication skills and manners they'll need for the rest of their life and at that point, it's best to have them playing with dogs they're familiar with and/or are owned by people you know.
 

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see I disagree with socializing with strange dogs all together, with my experiences and having Strange dogs attack us who the owners said are friendly, things like that to me arent worth the risk at all. Im sure if you had to sit while they stitched your 4 month old pup you might have a different view on it. People and dogs you know I say are fine as long as supervised. If you train your dog properly and learn how to have them focus on you , you wont have the issue of them flipping out inthe store if they see another dog , thats a training issue not socializing issue IMO.
 

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It wouldn't have to be a training issue if you socialized the potential issue first.

But you're right. We're coming from two different places here. :)
 

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i see both points of views as i am debating cutting parks out of Samson s routine.......

there is always a guaranteed safety when u take no risks and that is angelbaby's perspective which i must admit has its logic.

but i have to believe the same way an APBT is not bred for fighting anymore so therefore the aggressive ones arent the sire s on most reputable breeders right??? so why cant be expect the breed to evolve into a more docile dog towards other same sex dogs eventually? and if so...when do we test this eventually?? when the apbt is out of the spotlight and people find another bad dog of the new era ??? like dobermans, german shepards and now pitbulls... discussing this opens minds on both sides so i am all for listening always.

good friday to all....tomorrow is end of the year yay!!!
 

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The problem with genetics is that once you breed something in, it's hard to breed it back out, especially after hundreds of generations. Especially something like dog aggression, which we know has a genetic component but that we haven't been able to isolate to one solitary genetic factor but instead probably a combination of them.
 

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i see both points of views as i am debating cutting parks out of Samson s routine.......

there is always a guaranteed safety when u take no risks and that is angelbaby's perspective which i must admit has its logic.

but i have to believe the same way an APBT is not bred for fighting anymore so therefore the aggressive ones arent the sire s on most reputable breeders right??? so why cant be expect the breed to evolve into a more docile dog towards other same sex dogs eventually? and if so...when do we test this eventually?? when the apbt is out of the spotlight and people find another bad dog of the new era ??? like dobermans, german shepards and now pitbulls... discussing this opens minds on both sides so i am all for listening always.

good friday to all....tomorrow is end of the year yay!!!
the only thing with that is how long will it take to breed that trait out? I dont think it can be. Although there are some who dont have DA at all , however how do you tell when it can pop up at any age? You can say at 2 you have never seen any sign and the dog isnt DA at all ,then at 5 it pops up. There is always a 1st for everything, I had dogs live happily together every day for over a year then 1 day it changed, do you want to take the chance that the 1 day it changes is in the dog park with some strangers dog ? Kinda sets the breed as a whole up to fail, they then turn around and go to the media about the vicious pit bull attack ect ect. All it takes is 1 time and there goes your dog , they take him and you never see him again, worth the risk to you? Sure isnt to me. Like I said there are some who never show DA in there life and those owners should be thankful they never have to worry about it, but when it can pop up at any age I think alot of people form this false sense of security. I know I had one , Had my girls all get along thought nothing of it , I took proper measures with my males i knew what they were capable of but my girls? nah they are sweet and love eachother. WRONG. I got a huge wake up call very recently, this after being together problem free for over a year. cost me $2400. I havent mentioned it on here really before ,but I just hope others with young dogs are aware of this issue that can come up and they dont have to find out the hard way. Im lucky what happened went down on my yard and not in some public dog park with witnesses and someone elses dog the victim. Really think it through and decide for yourself if its worth the risk , 1 time is all it takes. Not saying dont take to the park but there are other places to go other then the dog park , go to the lake or go hiking, or on trails or just a people park . If you have enclosed baseball diamonds or lacross rings or tennis courts go when they arent being used and play off leash in there alone , there are always options.
 
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the only thing with that is how long will it take to breed that trait out? I dont think it can be. Although there are some who dont have DA at all , however how do you tell when it can pop up at any age? You can say at 2 you have never seen any sign and the dog isnt DA at all ,then at 5 it pops up. There is always a 1st for everything, I had dogs live happily together every day for over a year then 1 day it changed, do you want to take the chance that the 1 day it changes is in the dog park with some strangers dog ? Kinda sets the breed as a whole up to fail, they then turn around and go to the media about the vicious pit bull attack ect ect. All it takes is 1 time and there goes your dog , they take him and you never see him again, worth the risk to you? Sure isnt to me. Like I said there are some who never show DA in there life and those owners should be thankful they never have to worry about it, but when it can pop up at any age I think alot of people form this false sense of security. I know I had one , Had my girls all get along thought nothing of it , I took proper measures with my males i knew what they were capable of but my girls? nah they are sweet and love eachother. WRONG. I got a huge wake up call very recently, this after being together problem free for over a year. cost me $2400. I havent mentioned it on here really before ,but I just hope others with young dogs are aware of this issue that can come up and they dont have to find out the hard way. Im lucky what happened went down on my yard and not in some public dog park with witnesses and someone elses dog the victim. Really think it through and decide for yourself if its worth the risk , 1 time is all it takes. Not saying dont take to the park but there are other places to go other then the dog park , go to the lake or go hiking, or on trails or just a people park . If you have enclosed baseball diamonds or lacross rings or tennis courts go when they arent being used and play off leash in there alone , there are always options.
:goodpost:
I can't give you any more rep until I spread the love. LOL!
 

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Im sorry but I have to disagree with those who say that these dogs should be treated like wild killing animals. Not every dog is the same. The dog is only as social as the owner makes him. The best example of a dog that looks like a killing machine but will prove anybody wrong with his calm attitude under any circumstance is the great Daddy, Cesar's pit bull that past away. Perfect example of owner molding his dog. To me not all dogs are the same. I've seen chiwawas behave worst then most pit bulls. We are in 2012 people, The days of the killer pit bull are over. The pit bull is as aggressive as the owner lets him be. If your dog cant behave at the park don't blame it on the breed, blame it on your lack of effort to make him social.

Some owners have these dogs and although they don't keep them in a backyard chained and hanging weights from their necks, but they go around acting as if the dog should be feared. Why? What's going on here? This was the first dog at the white house, this was the famous Petey in the movie the little rascals. How is it that in a dogfight they tear each other up and bite chunks off each other yet they don't bite the handlers?

I would love for my dog to be judged individually, not by others irresponsibility. If you treat your dog like he's gonna attack someone or another dog, more then likely he will.
 

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Dog aggression has a genetic component. It's true there are some dogs that never display dog aggression. But to say that your dog is only dog aggressive because you didn't socialize it enough is false. There are some dogs you can socialize out the wazoo and they still will not like other dogs.

And, unfortunately, your dog will always be judged because of someone else's irresponsibility, simply because of the type of dog he is. It's a fact of life you have to acknowledge and come to terms with as an owner.
 

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How is it that in a dogfight they tear each other up and bite chunks off each other yet they don't bite the handlers?
Because Man Biters were not tolerated when creating the breed, that's why. Do you know any of the history of where and how this breed came to be? Human Aggression and Animal Aggression are extremely different in regards to this breed. When you hear of a pit bull that has attacked a human unprovoked, there is something wrong with that dog and it should not have been bred. HA and DA are NOT the same thing and should NEVER be compared. You can have the gentlest dog in the world and have a dog come at him the wrong way and its over. The only times I have been bite were from the other dogs who started with mine, never my own.

whoooooo hold up. who is saying to treat their dogs like wild killing animals? My dog is extremely dog aggressive, you think I am encouraging this?? You think I don't try to work with him every single day to keep it in check and let him know he is ok and doesn't need to worry. you know what messes that up? Irresponsible owners who allow their dogs off leash in public. Its not about treating my dog anyway. He met other dogs, owners who I KNOW and TRUST and who understand that dog aggression can pop at any time. By having multiple dogs come up to him and attack him while we were walking, he does not trust any dogs running up to him. I can't blame him. Its in his history of the breed, which I respect. Its not something he was taught or lack of socialization.

Owning this breed is NOT like owning every other breed of dog. They should and MUST be respected and treated like they were bred to be treated. Having your dog at a dog park is irresponsible and lazy. There are way better and responsible ways to socialize and exercise your dog. Take a look here and learn before you put your dog into a situation he has to defend himself and then your dog get blamed no matter who is at fault.

no one is saying not to let your dog interact with other dogs if he has not shown signs of being dog aggressive, we are saying you need to be smart or else you will wind up on the news saying "he never had an issue before I don't know what happened"

Fighting dogs in the states was only outlawed in the 70's. To think 30 -40 years is enough time to bred out of them what it took a hundred years to instill is just ridiculousness. Especially since you hear of people who STILL fight dogs illegally all the time on the news and what not. I in no way condone fighting dogs, but I respect that's where they came from, and you MUST if you own a bulldog as well!
 

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No one here ever said these dogs are killing machines , they should never be human aggressive that isnt tolerable in any breed IMO. I agree with you on the chihuahua part they are some nasty lil dogs lol .
But I dont think you are getting the genetic make up of this breed DA is part of this breed whether you chose to accept it or not its there. I hopeyou dont ever have to deal with it but saying that its the handlers fault if there dog is DA shows your lack of experience and knowledge of this breed. Many on here who handle dogs for profession and have years upon years of experience with this breed have DA dogs, the way your saying it would be there fault ? I think laws against this breed in dog parks protect us as owners who care about this breed and how its portrayed in the medias eyes and the other owners at these parks from those owners like you who think there dog is special and dont carry the same genetic make up the rest of the breed carry. There are many threads on here about dog parks and the risks and reasons why its bad , would do alot of good to take a look through them. AGAIN this is not saying this breed are killing machines and should be feared by people cause if that were the case I wouldnt have them around my young kids. This is one minor downfall to this breed { nothing compared to some breeds} but there are alot more positives tomake up for this. Just think if you dont set your dog up to fail it wont , dog parks are a big FAIL IMO.
http://www.gopitbull.com/do-yourself/4269-so-your-thinking-about-dog-park.html
http://www.gopitbull.com/general-discussion/41751-dog-park.html
http://www.gopitbull.com/general-discussion/36349-pitbulls-dog-parks.html

And to note on the Cesear milan comment , although Im maybe one of the few on here that do like him and SOME of his techniques I think he offers a very false sense of security with his show and this breed. You dont get to see the hours, days, weeks he takes with some dogs its condensed into a short tv show he makes things look alot easier. You also dont always see the fights that have broken out on his yards with his own dogs and with ones he is training. I believe it showed one fight once but alot of them they dont air. He does have issues pop up that he has to address just as any of us with multiples do. Have you not seen him carry a break stick? if his pack never fights or he felt secure to think they never would why would he carry one?
 

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OP, here are some great links to help you understand dog aggression in petbulls.

Dog Aggression in Pit Bulls | PitBulls

Dog/Dog Tolerance | BAD RAP

I would highly suggest you read what they have to say and take it to heart. If you notice, neither of those links say you can't have your dog around other dogs -- BUT they DO say that you have to be aware of your dog's tolerance level and the potential that it can change no matter how much socialization you give your dog as a puppy. Even the most minor changes in body language and your dog's responses to another dog is evidence that their tolerance may be changing.

My dog Kane has changed in his tolerance level as he's matured. I took him to the dog park all the time when he was a puppy and then to doggy daycare as well. He was socialized out the wazoo with other dogs, strange dogs, familiar dogs, every dog we saw. Around 14 months of age, I started noticing little things. He was still laid-back and easy-going with most dogs, but he started to get snippier earlier if another dog was rude to him. He would let the first couple of tackles or humps or barks in the face go, but if the other dog didn't listen to him telling them to knock it off or back off, that's when he would step it up again and I could tell that if they ignored his next warning, he would back up his warning with a physical telling off, such as snapping at them or what have you.

And this is normal for ANY dog as they reach maturity. Most dog's tolerances change as they get older. They don't need or want to be friends with every dog they meet; they tend to stick with the ones they already know. Just like when we were little kids and anyone could be our friend, as we grew up, we changed and came to expect that strangers would have a certain level of politeness and manners. If they don't, we treat them the same way as dogs--we give them "looks" or other warnings.

Now, at 2 years, Kane still loves to play with other dogs and is eager to greet them. But he does have a certain amount of dog intolerance insofar as his temper is shorter for rude dogs. BUT I realize that and can manage it by setting him up to play with dogs who know appropriate play styles. If I had my head in the sand and denied that he was aggressive to some dogs at all, then it could lead to an accident that would be MY fault and could lead to Kane's DEATH.

edit: I also wanted to point out that both of these websites say that MOST pit bulls have some level of dog aggression in them, even if it's not necessarily a dog that goes ballistic at the sight of another dog--like Kane who has a lower tolerance for rude dogs. That's still dog aggression.
 

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Ah, welcome to the world of owning a Pit Bull type dog. I do not disagree with the dog park ban, I find dog parks to be great places for your dog to catch disease, get blamed for a fight it did not start or learn piss poor dog behavior.

One should not discount the fact that the breed was selectively bred for over a 100 years to fight other dogs. While it is true that dog/dog aggression is a trait that, genetically, is hard to fix (and harder to maintain) as it does nothing to further the survival of the dog, it is also true that it has been bred for and it will crop up.

Dog parks are great places for negative socialization to play on the genetics in your pup. I believe in socialization to as many people, objects, places and dogs you can MANAGE as your pup matures, but the key here is MANAGE. You can NOT manage your dogs interactions in a dog park, there are too many variables. Stupid people, aggressive dogs. Do not set your pup up for failure. Instead, get him out and about, and preferably into training classes and small play dates, where you and the other dogs/pups owners can MANAGE the play.

Keeping your dog at home, afraid to go out, or on a chain, does just as much damage to the development of his dog/dog skills (and dog/world skills) so don't think I am saying that. Just be in control of what your pup experiences and make his interactions positive.

PS Bitches are the worst when it comes to fights.
 

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Dog aggression has a genetic component. It's true there are some dogs that never display dog aggression. But to say that your dog is only dog aggressive because you didn't socialize it enough is false. There are some dogs you can socialize out the wazoo and they still will not like other dogs.

And, unfortunately, your dog will always be judged because of someone else's irresponsibility, simply because of the type of dog he is. It's a fact of life you have to acknowledge and come to terms with as an owner.
When you say your dog is naturally aggressive because of genetics, you already threw all the good qualities this dog's genetics posses. Someone up there mentioned if I knew the history of the breed, yes I do. I also know that they were the first choice in american homes in the 19th century. I know the story of a dog named stubby who helped our military in ww1. I haven't heard of one science report that says that the pit bull breed has more aggression then any other breed in the world. Until someone shows me that report. I will continue to fight for my dogs right to be treated equal to every other breed out there.
 

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HUMAN aggression and DOG aggression are not two sides of the same coin. "Pit bull" breeds are, by nature, dog aggressive due to hundreds of years of breeding for fighting in the pit, hence the name, American PIT bull terrier.

When it comes to pit bulls, aggression cannot be viewed as all encompassing. No one is saying that DA makes our dogs monsters, or killing machines, but you have to understand that to own any of the "pit bull" type dogs you cannot go in thinking that your dog is just like any other dog. That right there is the problem and a huge mistake.

There is a reason that pit bull rescue organizations, shelters and any other group well versed in the pill bull nature will recommend that pit bulls should be the only dog in a household or with a compatible dog of the opposite sex.

In the same way you cannot get a herding breed to stop herding no matter how many generations removed they are from an actual herd of sheep, and you cannot get a terrier to stop digging and burrowing and you cannot get a pointer to stop pointing even though it may spend its life on a couch. Those who truly appreciate the APBT understand that the good characteristics: extreme loyalty, eagerness to please, eagerness to work, etc come hand in hand with the "bad": dog aggression. We accept it and respect it. All the breed's traits combined are what make up our breed of choice and to change one part would be to change the whole.
 

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I will continue to fight for my dogs right to be treated equal to every other breed out there.
All breeds are NOT equal, though. That's why they are BREEDS. Each dog has qualities that come from their breeds that you have to keep in mind, respect, and sometimes manage.

If you get a herding breed like a border collie, most bc's will want to herd everything when they're a puppy. You have to teach them what is and is not appropriate to herd or you'll have problems down the line.

If you get a small terrier breed like a Jack Russell, you have to keep in mind that it's likely your dog will have a high prey drive and manage that by not having your dog off-leash in an unfenced area and by keeping any small rodents you may own as pets separate from your dog.

It's the same with pit bulls. It is a FACT that you will find discussed with EVERY SINGLE REPUTABLE pit bull rescue (you know, the organizations that deal with hundreds and thousands of these dogs every year) that you should be prepared for Dog Aggression in this "breed". They tell you to be prepared for it because most pit bull type dogs display it to some degree or another, even if it's just an intolerance for rude dogs.

That's why I gave you the links I did, to show you the spectrum from reputable sources. BAD RAP is the pit bull rescue that took in the Vick dogs. You think they aren't aware and knowledgeable about dog aggression? They explicitly state that is a fact of life you have to be aware of when having a pit bull type dog.

Again, we're not saying your dog WILL be dog aggressive, but we are saying that it's likely he will be and you need to be prepared for that. Otherwise I fear for you and your dog and what can happen.
 
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